who cares? hypocrisy’s a victimless crime

It impacts the perceived legitimacy of EU actions in the future.

The problem is that, particularly since Brexit, EU officials have been out of control in terms of going beyond their competence. Von der absolute shit Leyen going to Tel Aviv to hold hands with Netanyahu was the most obvious recent example of that. Fortunately, Jose Borrell was able to smooth it over - and that was just luck that the EU had a high representive for foreign affairs who knows the situation well and is trusted by all sides - lived on a kibbutz, met his Jewish ex-wife there, has two Jewish children. 

The absence of strong leaders of the leading member states has given them space to do so. It's telling that Macron, whom nobody thinks of as anything other than an Europhile, is the one giving pushback to the EU.

since Brexit, EU officials have been out of control

Lol

Absolutely eff that, the amnesty is going to be national embarrassment driven solely by a desperate attempt to maintain a lame duck administration 

I respectfully disagree, in any event it’s not going to achieve anything for PSOE except keeping Sanchez in office 

[Delete as you feel appropriate ]

@Asturias   Interesting.  The Good Friday Agreement included effective amnesties for Republican and Loyalist terrorists - like people who had actually murdered lots of people.  I don't think the Catalan independentists have done more than misuse their office/funds by organising a referendum.  The UK - to its credit - recognised that hard choice needed to be taken to get to what has been a 25 year peace and running.  

Rob

The GFA was the result of a painstaking  complex negotiation , mediated by literal giants of international diplomacy and some v subtle spy craft 

This is a fire sale by a desperate chancer

Are you really standing by your comparison ?

Setting that aside, it is gawdamn annoyingly shoite negotiating 

He’s giving them deft forgiveness AND amnesty AND annulling any historical crimes FOR WHAT?

He’s not even staged the offer? Ie give us a year and you get debt forgiveness, give us two and you get the annulling of historical crimes

It’s shockingly bad for the country to give away so much up front in return for feck all

@Asturias  Isn't "the country" Catalonia as well?   Wasn't all this sorry mess caused by the Spanish Constitutional Court intervening to strike down amendments to the statute of autonomy for Catalonia which had been passed by the Cortes and which gave Catalonia no more than some other regions of Spain already enjoy?  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Statute_of_Autonomy_of_Catalonia_of_2006  And the Spanish Supreme Court did so by a 6-4 majority 

Yes m8 the “Country” includes Catalonia , but even nationalists politicians have responsibilities to Spain too. Theo’s isn’t the end game it’s a step and pulling toxic crap along the way cuts both ways. The courts are literally defending the constitution nothing else, they have signaled loud and clear that this is a terrible idea 

Look how awesome it worked out for NI when the DUP absolutely stuck it to the UK government for cash in order to remain in majority at Westminster ? Or how the one sided amnesty has helped reassure unionists that the security forces from the 90s won’t be harried in the future 

Spoiler, it’s hasn’t helped achieve shoite for anyone that last 2 years .

The courts are literally defending the constitution nothing else, they have signaled loud and clear that this is a terrible idea

I think you have a messed up view of how a constitutional order should work if you think it's right for "the courts" to be "signalling" their view on legislation before it is enacted.

It's interesting to me that the Spanish right is making such an issue of an amnesty now when modern Spain is founded on a historic compromise in the late 1970s that included amnesty for all those who committed state crimes under the Franco regime. 

Again with the comparison to greater people?

The “forgetting” was a (say it softly) consensus.

This is not.

 And yes, a constitutional court in a functioning democracy is ok in my book to  look at a flaming train being driven by the Government that’s coming down the tracks, point and say “that looks an awful lot like a multi tun wheeled conveyance on fixed path that appears to have smoke billowing from its slates”, you sure about that?

Hi Asturias, it may be okay in your book, but that's not how normal constitutional courts work in countries that have a normal separation of powers, e.g. the UK Supreme Court decided the Rwanda case after litigation had commenced and gone through the High Court and Court of Appeal. You didn't get Supreme Court members sounding off about it when the plans were originally announced. Ditto in Germany with the Bundesverfassungsgericht. 

I forget how recent the current (or any) constitutional order is in Spain - less than my lifetime - compared with other western European countries.

Heh

The Spanish Constitutional order survived an actual coup attempt since emerging from a dictatorship 

They have a lot to be proud of 

Given the dumpster fire that UK politics has become I’d expect a touch more humility before lording over the Spanish system TBH

I only trust rob cannon for hard hitting geopolitical hot takes 🔥 

Hi Asturias.  It wasn't the Spanish lawyers who stopped the coup though.  BTW I'm Irish so not sure why I should have humility about how Spain lines up relative to the UK.

Perhaps the problem is with the high threshold in the Spanish constitution for constitutional amendments, i.e. 2/3 vote in the Cortes plus referendum.  It's similar to the problems in the US - if it is difficult to amend the constitution then you have the situation where a consistent majority in the Cortes can be frustrated by a politicised judiciary (and the Spanish judiciary is certainly politicised compared with the UK). Other western European countries have lower thresholds for constitutional change, e.g. Italy is 2/3 majority in parliament OR a majority plus a referendum, Germany; France is 60% majority in joint sitting of parliament OR a majority plus a referendum.

Nonsense, granting an amnesty for politically motivated historical crimes is obviously a legitimate thing for a Government to do if it choses too, and not even close to the issues in Rumania in which the EU intervened which was about forgiving and thus encouraging corruption, the suppression of which has always been a key EU goal.  

Obviously its a quid pro quo and part of coalition building to maintain the Government, but that is exactly how these things are supposed to work, and do work in all states that form coalition governments.   

There is nothing in this that is inappropriate or undermines any judicial power, the truth is you just disagree with it.