They ought to replace it with a gift tax. Break the link with bereavement. Any gift you get over £100k is taxed. Where cash, the bank is responsible for deduction.
The Daily Mail doesn't even get them cross about it. It's a tiny rump of old school/ "silver spoon" Tories and their press equivalents. Everyone else either doesn't care or actively wants IHT to be raised.
It isn't really a tax on dead people. If you say this, then people get very upset and say that "the money has already been taxed once".
It's more like a withholding tax. It's a convenient way for the government to collect tax on latent capital gains and to cream off money from people who have done f-all to earn it.
Agreed we should tax income (aka people actually being productive) less than inheritance (aka people sitting on their arses waiting for their parents to die and cashing in the untaxed property gains)
Agreed we should tax income (aka people actually being productive) less than inheritance (aka people sitting on their arses waiting for their parents to die and cashing in the untaxed property gains)
EASY FOR YOU TO SAY BUT WHAT ABOUT THE POOR ORPHANS IN THEIR FIFTIES WHO HAVE BEEN LEFT WITHOUT A MUM AND DAD AND ARE NOW GOING TO RECEIVE LESS THAN THEY WERE LOOKING FORWARD TO GETTING?!?
and i guess a lot of people would like to feel they can leave something for their kids to help them out. yeah yeah about the threshold. that's not going to buy them a nice house in fulham is it?
I imagine a gift tax would be a LOT less popular than IHT amongst the beneficiaries of BOMAD. Unless there were a v high threshold.
In the paper it said Rishi wanted to pledge abolishing IHT when standing for party leader first time round but didnt as he was worried about looking desperate. Hah! An admission that he’s now desperate.
All/any parties are going to have to raise taxes if they’re going to satisfy Uk’s growing desire to be more socialist. Not lower them.
It seems like a policy you'd pursue if you're giving up all pretence at winning the election, and are just focused on getting enough of your most psychotic voters out to make sure you don't preside over the Tories becoming the third largest party in Parliament.
OH GOSH YES ME TOO BUT WE HAVE TO PRIORITISE SO SURELY WE SHOULD BE CONCENTRATING ON THE PLIGHT OF THE POOR ORPHANED FIFTY-SOMETHING YEAR OLDS WHO HAVE BEEN LOOKING FORWARD TO INHERITING FOR A VERY LONG TIME AND REALLY FEEL THEY’VE EARNED IT!!
I'd scrap stamp tax duty for main residences and put CGT on all property sales, subject to tapering for main residence.
Also scrap council tax and replace it with a tax based on the rental value of the property, payable by the owners not the tenants in the case of rented properties.
I would rather it were gone. Sweden has abolished it. I would like a smaller state too and much less state provision. I get a £325k IHT free allowance only (as am single and in the SE etc) and unusually my house equity has been taxed at at least 40% (due to my divorce etc).
I read a detailed paper about a gift tax a year ago but that was very complicated - I think Ireland has one. The paper looked at including gifts to children I think including a car and also if you allow a child to live rent free at home as that is a benefit to them too. I am not sure about helping them with university costs. Anyway it would be an administrative nightmare.
Good to see Lydia call for us to follow Sweden’s tax system - they had the highest income tax rate in the world so very generous of her to offer to give it to the state now rather than waiting for her to die.
Lydia - when you say your house equity has been taxed at 40%, I assume you mean that you had to buy your ex husband out of his 50% share the family home at its value at the time of divorce using income that had been taxed in your hands? That's hardly the same thing, and the chorus of tiny violins is warming up in anticipation.
That's the problem with tax in this country. No one wants to admit that they are wealthy enough to pay any tax. Everyone looks around nervously expecting someone else to pick up the tab.
And yes, Coracle, they then start cherry-picking other tax systems.
So yes, Sweden has no IHT, but it has income tax rates way higher than ours.
Switzerland has no CGT, but has wealth taxes.
In the US, almost everyone goes to the local high school, but it is paid for out of local property taxes that, for the affluent middle classes, basically amount to the cost of a UK independent school.
Taxes are created for expediency not out of principle, so arguing over what’s fair is beside the point. The question is what you are prepared to put up with. Me: not much.
If the value of the property went down then you wouldn't be taxed that year
Same as if you didn't earn anything that year
It's not difficult
Basically the current system of iht just takes money off a small number of people (who can afford it) and in reality it should be far higher if we are interested in creating a fairer society
I would hazard a guess that most people that pay it are Tories
We should move to a US-style system, where property tax (what we currently call council tax, but doesn't meaningfully fund council expenditure) is a significant sum (like £25k a year rather than £1.5k a year). It funds local services properly and is progressive.
Yes, some people who are not cash-rich live in massive houses, and will have to move, but so be it.
My proposals for IHT are either (1) tax it as income over a threshold or (2) abolish it and tax property price increases yearly as income
Your point (2) is interesting as it should in fairness mean that tax payers should be entitled to a rebate in the years that property actually prices fall, rather than rise (ie valued on a mark to market basis). If so, the country would probably go bust if there was a proper property price crash!
'In the tax year 2020 to 2021, 3.73% of UK deaths resulted in an Inheritance Tax charge according government stats'
misleading stat because of exempt spouse transfer, so probably nearer 5% when considering families. And that's broadly the same % as those on a salary >£100k
Not a bean, Dave. Don't you see how regressive it is to say someone can afford to not have something they don't currently have? Or are you a fan of perpetuating misery?
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Don’t get the hate for iht at all
can see why Tory doners/the owners of the daily Mail/55 Tufton St hate it but I don’t really care about them tbh
I’d happily support a party that wants to hike IHT and cut income tax
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DISGUSTING: YOU WOULD RATHER THAT PEOPLE'S HARD WORK IS TAXED LESS THAN THE MONEY THEY SIMPLY INHERIT?!?
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They would cut spending by an equivalent amount. Or just borrow.
I don't get the IHT thing. It's part of the cancer that is this country's obsession with property wealth.
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Ask for the PPE bungs back?
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They ought to replace it with a gift tax. Break the link with bereavement. Any gift you get over £100k is taxed. Where cash, the bank is responsible for deduction.
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In the tax year 2020 to 2021, 3.73% of UK deaths resulted in an Inheritance Tax charge according government stats.
Why the hell do the other 96% give ff about IHT. Cancelling will only ever increase their tax burden.
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I also dont get the hate - it is a tax on dead people. The only people it affects literally can't give a tug.*
*before buzz interjects, I concede that rigor mortis coukd in certain unfortunate circumstance lead to the impression of a post mortem shuffle
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I'd honestly vote Lab if he does this.
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‘Why the hell do the other 96% give ff about IHT. Cancelling will only ever increase their tax burden’
Mainly because the daily Mail gets them very cross about it and tells them that granny’s jewellery will be sold to pay to house boat people
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Foal, I was actually going to add that but mention the Daily Express too.
"They tax you when you are alive they tax you when you are dead"
No they dont you daft twot, you are on benefits and live in a council house.
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The Daily Mail doesn't even get them cross about it. It's a tiny rump of old school/ "silver spoon" Tories and their press equivalents. Everyone else either doesn't care or actively wants IHT to be raised.
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The owners of the Mail and the Express are obsessive about this issue
Doubt it affects even 1% of their readership
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I think it is aimed at those poor sods who aspire to benefit from Tory policies but never will.
Probably a big overlap with brexit voters who just dont understand.
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It isn't really a tax on dead people. If you say this, then people get very upset and say that "the money has already been taxed once".
It's more like a withholding tax. It's a convenient way for the government to collect tax on latent capital gains and to cream off money from people who have done f-all to earn it.
Bring it on.
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BUT IT'S ASPIRATIONAL FOR THE 96.27% TO THINK THEY CAN MAKE IT TO THE 3.73%!!!
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They ought to replace it with a gift tax.
So, Clergs, effectively bring back Capital Transfer Tax?
*awaits yelps from those replying on playing the BOMAD game*
Personally, my long held view is that capital taxes should be on those who are in receipt of capital, not on the givers.
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Agreed we should tax income (aka people actually being productive) less than inheritance (aka people sitting on their arses waiting for their parents to die and cashing in the untaxed property gains)
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Typical Davos and typically confused. What’s wrong with earning by doing nothing? That is most people’s dream and most people try it.
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Permitted rent seeking to go untaxed whilst taxing productivity is not a particularly sound fiscal policy though is it brains
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EASY FOR YOU TO SAY BUT WHAT ABOUT THE POOR ORPHANS IN THEIR FIFTIES WHO HAVE BEEN LEFT WITHOUT A MUM AND DAD AND ARE NOW GOING TO RECEIVE LESS THAN THEY WERE LOOKING FORWARD TO GETTING?!?
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it's a tax on prudence, hard work, success and on dying (and not spending enough on tax planning tbh).
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and i guess a lot of people would like to feel they can leave something for their kids to help them out. yeah yeah about the threshold. that's not going to buy them a nice house in fulham is it?
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I imagine a gift tax would be a LOT less popular than IHT amongst the beneficiaries of BOMAD. Unless there were a v high threshold.
In the paper it said Rishi wanted to pledge abolishing IHT when standing for party leader first time round but didnt as he was worried about looking desperate. Hah! An admission that he’s now desperate.
All/any parties are going to have to raise taxes if they’re going to satisfy Uk’s growing desire to be more socialist. Not lower them.
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Income tax and CGT are taxes on hard work and success. This is an objection that goes nowhere.
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What happened to windfall taxing the utilities? As well as Baroness Hooters and her mates
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i object to IT and CGT as well to be honest
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It seems like a policy you'd pursue if you're giving up all pretence at winning the election, and are just focused on getting enough of your most psychotic voters out to make sure you don't preside over the Tories becoming the third largest party in Parliament.
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"it's a tax on prudence, hard work, success"
What Gloria said.
Surely income tax is more a tax on "hard work" than IHT is?
IHT falls on the estate but the cost of it is borne by the recipient who has not worked at all for the money.
The state has to get money from somewhere. Surely better to take it from unearned funds than through income tax?
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Lollicopters. How do you expect the government to raise revenue to cover even the basics of state support?
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IHT is a tax on your parents being able to afford a house and never paying a penny tax on its price increase
My proposals for IHT are either (1) tax it as income over a threshold or (2) abolish it and tax property price increases yearly as income
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"How do you expect the government to raise revenue to cover even the basics of state support?"
Well I think he's a Tory so doesn't care about such things
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OH GOSH YES ME TOO BUT WE HAVE TO PRIORITISE SO SURELY WE SHOULD BE CONCENTRATING ON THE PLIGHT OF THE POOR ORPHANED FIFTY-SOMETHING YEAR OLDS WHO HAVE BEEN LOOKING FORWARD TO INHERITING FOR A VERY LONG TIME AND REALLY FEEL THEY’VE EARNED IT!!
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I don't think imposing yearly tax charges on increases in property value would work, not least because these are "dry" tax charges.
Would you pay anything back for years in which the price falls - like now?
I'd tax gifts in excess of a threshold to stop people using the 7 yr rule to dodge it.
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I'd scrap stamp tax duty for main residences and put CGT on all property sales, subject to tapering for main residence.
Also scrap council tax and replace it with a tax based on the rental value of the property, payable by the owners not the tenants in the case of rented properties.
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And keep IHT.
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I would rather it were gone. Sweden has abolished it. I would like a smaller state too and much less state provision. I get a £325k IHT free allowance only (as am single and in the SE etc) and unusually my house equity has been taxed at at least 40% (due to my divorce etc).
I read a detailed paper about a gift tax a year ago but that was very complicated - I think Ireland has one. The paper looked at including gifts to children I think including a car and also if you allow a child to live rent free at home as that is a benefit to them too. I am not sure about helping them with university costs. Anyway it would be an administrative nightmare.
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Good to see Lydia call for us to follow Sweden’s tax system - they had the highest income tax rate in the world so very generous of her to offer to give it to the state now rather than waiting for her to die.
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Lydia - when you say your house equity has been taxed at 40%, I assume you mean that you had to buy your ex husband out of his 50% share the family home at its value at the time of divorce using income that had been taxed in your hands? That's hardly the same thing, and the chorus of tiny violins is warming up in anticipation.
That's the problem with tax in this country. No one wants to admit that they are wealthy enough to pay any tax. Everyone looks around nervously expecting someone else to pick up the tab.
And yes, Coracle, they then start cherry-picking other tax systems.
So yes, Sweden has no IHT, but it has income tax rates way higher than ours.
Switzerland has no CGT, but has wealth taxes.
In the US, almost everyone goes to the local high school, but it is paid for out of local property taxes that, for the affluent middle classes, basically amount to the cost of a UK independent school.
Suck it up - someone has to...
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Taxes are created for expediency not out of principle, so arguing over what’s fair is beside the point. The question is what you are prepared to put up with. Me: not much.
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If the value of the property went down then you wouldn't be taxed that year
Same as if you didn't earn anything that year
It's not difficult
Basically the current system of iht just takes money off a small number of people (who can afford it) and in reality it should be far higher if we are interested in creating a fairer society
I would hazard a guess that most people that pay it are Tories
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Britain is a fvcking shitshow shocka
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All countries are, just in different ways. And in every case the solution is the same: make your own nest.
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I don't think the requirement for annual valuations of every single property is practical, plus people will squeal too much about the dry tax charges.
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We should move to a US-style system, where property tax (what we currently call council tax, but doesn't meaningfully fund council expenditure) is a significant sum (like £25k a year rather than £1.5k a year). It funds local services properly and is progressive.
Yes, some people who are not cash-rich live in massive houses, and will have to move, but so be it.
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My proposals for IHT are either (1) tax it as income over a threshold or (2) abolish it and tax property price increases yearly as income
Your point (2) is interesting as it should in fairness mean that tax payers should be entitled to a rebate in the years that property actually prices fall, rather than rise (ie valued on a mark to market basis). If so, the country would probably go bust if there was a proper property price crash!
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Don't allow rebates - just 0 or taxed
Ultimately untaxed property gains have played a large part in creating inequality and it needs to be resolved
If we could crash the boomer housing market that is just an additional small benefit
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IHT one of the best taxes out there. Only lazy aunts who fund their life on inherited wealth or aunts with lazy kids object.
see labour will put 20 percent vat on private school fees, good.
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'In the tax year 2020 to 2021, 3.73% of UK deaths resulted in an Inheritance Tax charge according government stats'
misleading stat because of exempt spouse transfer, so probably nearer 5% when considering families. And that's broadly the same % as those on a salary >£100k
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'iht just takes money off a small number of people (who can afford it)'
The beneficiary or the deceased?
Saying a beneficiary can afford to not have money they don't currently have is total communism
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Nonsense. If anything, hand outs from your parents are communism
No doubt you inherited or stand to inherit lots?
Most people don't
Most people have to work for a living
I inherited nothing but a chip on my shoulder and a work ethic that can't be matched
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Not a bean, Dave. Don't you see how regressive it is to say someone can afford to not have something they don't currently have? Or are you a fan of perpetuating misery?
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I'm a big fan of making society better
Very few people who are 'living in misery' will stand to inherit a lot. Those types will have had lots of advantages in life.
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Where is the evidence that collecting more tax directly makes society better?
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Not going to bother with that torychucker
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It's easy to find £7bn:
/Tories
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EXACTLY! EXACTLY!!
IF I CAN’T HAVE TAX FREE MONEY FROM MUMMY AND DADDY WHEN THEY’RE DEAD IT’S TOTAL COMMUNISM!!
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If we could crash the boomer housing market that is just an additional small benefit
Takes a lot of Gen X down with it too.
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