I totally agree on the dragon riding bit. Sure, show us Jon is allowed on the dragon, but 10 mins of riding and a cringefest by the waterfall was too much. Although I thought it was interesting that Dany mentioned something about staying there forever. Similar to something Ygritte said to Jon in the cave?
Given how long they spent on the dragons I was underwhelmed with the overly speedy/easy rescue of Yara, bit anticlimactic.
I thought they did the Jon reveal quite well, any scene with Sam in is a hit with me.
Some questions:
1. Is Cersei even preggers or was that all lies
2. Did you notice the Ed Sheeran reference (that ginger lad Eddie who got his face all burnt off...)
3. What does Jamie thinks he is doing? Surely he can’t just waltz into Winterfell where resides the boy he crippled and the woman whose father he murdered?? Surely he’s going straight in a cell?
and my Gendry as heir with Arya at his side theory is shaping up nicely. Apparently Arya’s weapon is going to be quite significant too.
I anticipate that the Brianne love triangle will ft in Ep 2 once Tormund makes it to Winterfell, looking forward to that.
Agree regarding the Aegon/Jon reveal brilliantly done.
This actually puts Aejon on an absolute collision course with Dany unless they get married. There is no way that Aejon cannot claim his throne or bend to Dany now, honour which is everything he lives for demands nothing less.
The other big issue unresolved or addressed at present is that once a dragon has been ridden it has essentially been claimed.. and belongs to the rider. So Aejon now essentially owns Rheagal (a dragon Dany incidentially named in memory of Aejon's father)… and has been witnessed riding him in the skies above Winterfell.
Therefore Dany no longer owns three dragons.. she has one. Which is a huge power dynamic shift.
Jamie is on his redemptive character arc. If he survives the battles to come I entirely expect Jamie to be appointed to either Aejon or Dany's (whoever claims the throne) Kingsguard as its Commander. Brienne will play a larger role in this and Bran. Remember that Bran would never have become the three eyed raven if Jamie hadn't thrown him from the tower.
Also Barristan the Bold and Varys have already told Dany the reasons that Jamie killed her father and she has accepted that her father was utterly mad.
This is pretty heavily foreshadowed in the books and will be phrased as that he isn't there to protect the King but also the people from the King. Much the same way as Dany asked Varys to always tell her if he had issues with her rule for the common people rather than go behind her back.
I also expect Arya's weapon to be highly significant but have no idea what for.
Big question over whether Bronn murders the brothers though or finally chooses friendship and loyalty over money. That will be an interesting play out.
It is entirely possible that Aejon could unbastard him and make him the Baratheon heir which means he becomes the Lord of the Stormlands without him then becoming the heir to the Iron Throne.
All other known Baratheon's are dead after Stannis, Renly and Shireen.
Re him and Arya. Not sure. Arya doesn't really strike me as the marrying kind. I just hope she gets back with Nymeria at some point though they seem super reluctant to actually spend any money on the direwolf production which annoys me no end.
Lady (Sansa), Grey Wind (Robb), Summer (Bran), Shaggy Dog (Rickon) are all dead but Ghost and Nymeria remain.
Last mention of Ghost was when Sansa and Arya were talking last season and Sansa said..
'The North isn't like Ghost, Jon can't just leave it and expect it to be here when he returns'. So that means Jon left him at Winterfell when he went south to visit Dany.
Sansa has no legitimate claim to the throne and any inclination on that score by Aejon was in relation solely to her claims as a Stark to the North and was before he knew he was the rightful heir to the Iron Throne.
It would be so easy to say that ASOIAF is about Ice and Fire, Stark and Targ and that AeJon is the crux of everything. So he will end up on the Iron Throne.
But this is GRRM we are talking about so we have to be prepared for ANY outcome.
yes and legitimacy for the throne is in no way necessary. baratheon for example.
was it blackadder who said something along the lines of "the only qualification for the throne is that your ancestors were bigger murdering bastards than anyone else's"
The trailer for next week that they showed at the end of Thronecast (yes I am that geeky) showed Jaime in the hall in front of everyone, looked like he was on trial
pretty sure that it will be a case of 'look, we need to focus on the zombies for a bit, people' though
agreed that the dragon riding was cringy
did Wang miss the in-joke scene with Bronn and the hookers?!
Bronn will never kill Tyrion (remember the 'whatever you are offered, I will pay double'?)
agree that Gendry has a role here otherwise what was the point of bringing him back?
I think there are any number of contenders for the Iron Throne and a great deal will depend on who simply survives the white walkers and the Night King and on that score I don't think anything is a given.
And even where any one of them dies Arya can always skin their face and take their identity and claim to the throne.
I'm wondering who Sansa will marry in the event she survives.
Her character arc could lead to any number of potential husbands as a girl she dreamed of knights and pretty princes and being Queen and yet she grew up treating the real prince like a piece of shit.
Then she was married to two men who totally failed in every aspect of her chivalric fantasies. Remeber she was originally desperate to marry Joffrey her 'prince' and then Loras Tyrell back in the day because he was so dreamy. Again neither of these lived up to the fantasy.
Now all fantasy has been shattered for her and she is a hard eyed pragmatist.
I've always had my suspicious about her and the Hound ending up together, remembering he did save her life several times when she was in King's Landing and engaged to Joffrey.
While he failed in every aspect of her youthful aesthetic fantasies, he is actually the only man who has ever truly protected her in his own gruff manner.
Or they could determine that her marriage to Tyrion is still valid and binding. However her attitude to him last night and dismissiveness wouldn't support this.
One thing to be wary of, the shows are not the books, if it’s not been in the show then I don’t think you can count on specific stuff like dragons being claimed.
I cant see Sansa marrying someone now, she’s had her share of that and there are no candidates unless she goes full politico.
Cersei did say she was cheggers so assume that is not a lie.
They did seem to be setting up Arya and and gendry.
Getting Bronn to kill his two closest friends is so ridiculously unlikely that I think he may actually do it. Cersei is no fool.
One thing to be wary of, the shows are not the books, if it’s not been in the show then I don’t think you can count on specific stuff like dragons being claimed
Given all the dragon lore that has been incorporated in theTV series from the books you can also hardly rule it out.
In the books a dragon rider only ever has one dragon and even in the TV series Dany has maintained that by only ever riding Drogon of the three dragons she had.
If there wasn't some specific connection between rider and dragon why didn't she ride either of the other two.
Finally watched it after avoiding all internet commentary for nearly a week!
I wonder if the deliberate echoes with S1.Ep1 extend to death touch of the King? Everyone Robert embraced or touched in the courtyard greeting scene ended up dead - does this mean everyone Jon embraced will kick the bucket too?
I think the spiral with Umber at the centre was a warning about Daenerys. Aflame, the spiral very clearly resembles the Targ sigil. GRRM has made several comments pointing at the idea that The Others are not as evil has painted.
agree that Gendry has a role here otherwise what was the point of bringing him back?
There's a theory that there has to be a Baratheon, a Lannister, a Targ and a Stark at the end - the end banner keeps those four sigils no matter what else changes, which now has even more currency given the arms of the astrolabe have changed.
Soz - I stand corrected. GRRM has explicitly told a fan that it could be annuled by the Septon apaz. I was getting confused by something he said at a con years ago where he said the legal system was based on early medieval where the monarch was the source of law.
What Supes said. She was pointedly not drinking for a time last season. It could still have been a lie then, but the teary facial expression when she took the sip of wine just after Euron had placed is hand on her belly points to losing a baby.
BTW, I don't remember realising you were a GoT nerd Scyll. Pleased to have a fellow uber-geek on board! I'm currently re-reading the books for the 7th time, plus re-watched the whole series again a couple of times during the hiatus.
Excellent! I used to be on Westoros.org and asiof.org but tend to stick to the Patreon chats for Alt-Shift-X, Lucifer Means Lightbringer and Preston now as ASIOF seems to be dominated by w**kers who insist THEY KNOW MORE THAN ANYONE about GoT these days and Elio and Linda seem huffy since they lost the gig on Sky.
I just saw a dara o brien tweet expressing surprise that bronn is jerome off of robson and jerome. htf did anyone not know that?
I was on a train back from the rugby to guildford once and he was in the same carriage. "you're jerome" said. "i know" he replied. I got everyone singing unchained melody at him. he didn't look amused. I may have had a few sherberts...
I was watching batman begins with the nippers yesterday, batman was giving a gadget to a random kid and I suddenly found myself shouting OMFG IT'S F'ING JOFFREY, KILL HIM BATMAN BEFORE ITS TOO LATE
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Twitter#JuegodeTronos
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Lazy bastards
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You need to get out more into the fresh air
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You are not dedicated enough
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When Winterfell saw all those brown people walking in:
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Thought it was ace. But not long enough, I thought every one of the last season was a mega-episode ?
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I have now watched. What would you like to discuss?
Frankly I found the whole dragon riding thing a bit ridiculous and I demand to see Ghost.
Interesting to see where this double tension point between Aegon/Jon and Daenerys now goes.
Additionally, the amount of ad breaks was insanity I am considering boycott cadburys who had the same advertisement on twice in every ad break.
Literally two scenes then a 10 minute ad break. Totally destroyed the flow of the episode.
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Yes ladies!!!
I totally agree on the dragon riding bit. Sure, show us Jon is allowed on the dragon, but 10 mins of riding and a cringefest by the waterfall was too much. Although I thought it was interesting that Dany mentioned something about staying there forever. Similar to something Ygritte said to Jon in the cave?
Given how long they spent on the dragons I was underwhelmed with the overly speedy/easy rescue of Yara, bit anticlimactic.
I thought they did the Jon reveal quite well, any scene with Sam in is a hit with me.
Some questions:
1. Is Cersei even preggers or was that all lies
2. Did you notice the Ed Sheeran reference (that ginger lad Eddie who got his face all burnt off...)
3. What does Jamie thinks he is doing? Surely he can’t just waltz into Winterfell where resides the boy he crippled and the woman whose father he murdered?? Surely he’s going straight in a cell?
and my Gendry as heir with Arya at his side theory is shaping up nicely. Apparently Arya’s weapon is going to be quite significant too.
I anticipate that the Brianne love triangle will ft in Ep 2 once Tormund makes it to Winterfell, looking forward to that.
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Fonders Walk of Shame
https://vimeo.com/162566435
Atonement badly needed
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Agree regarding the Aegon/Jon reveal brilliantly done.
This actually puts Aejon on an absolute collision course with Dany unless they get married. There is no way that Aejon cannot claim his throne or bend to Dany now, honour which is everything he lives for demands nothing less.
The other big issue unresolved or addressed at present is that once a dragon has been ridden it has essentially been claimed.. and belongs to the rider. So Aejon now essentially owns Rheagal (a dragon Dany incidentially named in memory of Aejon's father)… and has been witnessed riding him in the skies above Winterfell.
Therefore Dany no longer owns three dragons.. she has one. Which is a huge power dynamic shift.
Jamie is on his redemptive character arc. If he survives the battles to come I entirely expect Jamie to be appointed to either Aejon or Dany's (whoever claims the throne) Kingsguard as its Commander. Brienne will play a larger role in this and Bran. Remember that Bran would never have become the three eyed raven if Jamie hadn't thrown him from the tower.
Also Barristan the Bold and Varys have already told Dany the reasons that Jamie killed her father and she has accepted that her father was utterly mad.
This is pretty heavily foreshadowed in the books and will be phrased as that he isn't there to protect the King but also the people from the King. Much the same way as Dany asked Varys to always tell her if he had issues with her rule for the common people rather than go behind her back.
I also expect Arya's weapon to be highly significant but have no idea what for.
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I suspect Cersei is pregnant.
Big question over whether Bronn murders the brothers though or finally chooses friendship and loyalty over money. That will be an interesting play out.
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Re Gendry.
It is entirely possible that Aejon could unbastard him and make him the Baratheon heir which means he becomes the Lord of the Stormlands without him then becoming the heir to the Iron Throne.
All other known Baratheon's are dead after Stannis, Renly and Shireen.
Re him and Arya. Not sure. Arya doesn't really strike me as the marrying kind. I just hope she gets back with Nymeria at some point though they seem super reluctant to actually spend any money on the direwolf production which annoys me no end.
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I would happily watch a Bronn spin-off show.
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Didnt ghost die at some point? I defer to scy of course.
I am more and more convinced dany is getting topped and jon is declining the throne in favour of sansa
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Lady (Sansa), Grey Wind (Robb), Summer (Bran), Shaggy Dog (Rickon) are all dead but Ghost and Nymeria remain.
Last mention of Ghost was when Sansa and Arya were talking last season and Sansa said..
'The North isn't like Ghost, Jon can't just leave it and expect it to be here when he returns'. So that means Jon left him at Winterfell when he went south to visit Dany.
Sansa has no legitimate claim to the throne and any inclination on that score by Aejon was in relation solely to her claims as a Stark to the North and was before he knew he was the rightful heir to the Iron Throne.
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Key question: is it still full of nudity and lesbatron action?
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I dont think there were any norks oot last night
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It would be so easy to say that ASOIAF is about Ice and Fire, Stark and Targ and that AeJon is the crux of everything. So he will end up on the Iron Throne.
But this is GRRM we are talking about so we have to be prepared for ANY outcome.
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yes and legitimacy for the throne is in no way necessary. baratheon for example.
was it blackadder who said something along the lines of "the only qualification for the throne is that your ancestors were bigger murdering bastards than anyone else's"
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The trailer for next week that they showed at the end of Thronecast (yes I am that geeky) showed Jaime in the hall in front of everyone, looked like he was on trial
pretty sure that it will be a case of 'look, we need to focus on the zombies for a bit, people' though
agreed that the dragon riding was cringy
did Wang miss the in-joke scene with Bronn and the hookers?!
Bronn will never kill Tyrion (remember the 'whatever you are offered, I will pay double'?)
agree that Gendry has a role here otherwise what was the point of bringing him back?
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Total agree with that statement Wang.
I think there are any number of contenders for the Iron Throne and a great deal will depend on who simply survives the white walkers and the Night King and on that score I don't think anything is a given.
And even where any one of them dies Arya can always skin their face and take their identity and claim to the throne.
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Truedat. I have also been thinking "what is dead can never die" might have some bearing re Jon. maybe he will replace the night king?
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The flying scene was awful
went fully Neverending Story
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Joe Dempsie said that the ending was 'bittersweet' and 'won't please everyone'
I think that whoever ends up the 'winner' will not really have 'won'
I actually don't care, am enjoying the ride
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I loved the neverending story tbf
that bit with the horse
*wells up*
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I'm wondering who Sansa will marry in the event she survives.
Her character arc could lead to any number of potential husbands as a girl she dreamed of knights and pretty princes and being Queen and yet she grew up treating the real prince like a piece of shit.
Then she was married to two men who totally failed in every aspect of her chivalric fantasies. Remeber she was originally desperate to marry Joffrey her 'prince' and then Loras Tyrell back in the day because he was so dreamy. Again neither of these lived up to the fantasy.
Now all fantasy has been shattered for her and she is a hard eyed pragmatist.
I've always had my suspicious about her and the Hound ending up together, remembering he did save her life several times when she was in King's Landing and engaged to Joffrey.
While he failed in every aspect of her youthful aesthetic fantasies, he is actually the only man who has ever truly protected her in his own gruff manner.
Or they could determine that her marriage to Tyrion is still valid and binding. However her attitude to him last night and dismissiveness wouldn't support this.
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Tyrion marriage never consummated though?
I don't think she'll marry again and be an Elizabeth I on the iron throne
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Tyrion marriage also never officially annulled by a Septon.
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And Ramsey marriage was in the Godswood rather than the Sept...
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Also. Either Sansa or Arya have to marry and have children or the Starks will cease to exist.
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are we assuming that Bran is incapable then?
Interesting - do the 'old gods' or the 'new gods' have the higher legal status in Westeros then?
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One thing to be wary of, the shows are not the books, if it’s not been in the show then I don’t think you can count on specific stuff like dragons being claimed.
I cant see Sansa marrying someone now, she’s had her share of that and there are no candidates unless she goes full politico.
Cersei did say she was cheggers so assume that is not a lie.
They did seem to be setting up Arya and and gendry.
Getting Bronn to kill his two closest friends is so ridiculously unlikely that I think he may actually do it. Cersei is no fool.
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One thing to be wary of, the shows are not the books, if it’s not been in the show then I don’t think you can count on specific stuff like dragons being claimed
Given all the dragon lore that has been incorporated in theTV series from the books you can also hardly rule it out.
In the books a dragon rider only ever has one dragon and even in the TV series Dany has maintained that by only ever riding Drogon of the three dragons she had.
If there wasn't some specific connection between rider and dragon why didn't she ride either of the other two.
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That said dragons can be claimed by another rider after the death of their original rider.
Balerion the Black Dread was claimed by another Targ decades after the death of Aegon the Conqueror.
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Finally watched it after avoiding all internet commentary for nearly a week!
I wonder if the deliberate echoes with S1.Ep1 extend to death touch of the King? Everyone Robert embraced or touched in the courtyard greeting scene ended up dead - does this mean everyone Jon embraced will kick the bucket too?
I think the spiral with Umber at the centre was a warning about Daenerys. Aflame, the spiral very clearly resembles the Targ sigil. GRRM has made several comments pointing at the idea that The Others are not as evil has painted.
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0
There's a theory that there has to be a Baratheon, a Lannister, a Targ and a Stark at the end - the end banner keeps those four sigils no matter what else changes, which now has even more currency given the arms of the astrolabe have changed.
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The King/Queen would annul, not the Septons.
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Soz - I stand corrected. GRRM has explicitly told a fan that it could be annuled by the Septon apaz. I was getting confused by something he said at a con years ago where he said the legal system was based on early medieval where the monarch was the source of law.
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I'd say she's not anymore. She was drinking again.
And yes, I realise I'm just talking to myself on a days old conversation, but I've just rewatched bits.
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I'd say she's not anymore. She was drinking again.
Did she ever stop?
Not sure fetal alcohol system is a known thing in Westeros
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But she made a point of not drinking when speaking to Tyrion after the big pow wow.
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What Supes said. She was pointedly not drinking for a time last season. It could still have been a lie then, but the teary facial expression when she took the sip of wine just after Euron had placed is hand on her belly points to losing a baby.
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BTW, I don't remember realising you were a GoT nerd Scyll. Pleased to have a fellow uber-geek on board! I'm currently re-reading the books for the 7th time, plus re-watched the whole series again a couple of times during the hiatus.
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I refused to do another re read until we have a publication date for winds of winter.
I am a super GOT Nerd.
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Excellent! I used to be on Westoros.org and asiof.org but tend to stick to the Patreon chats for Alt-Shift-X, Lucifer Means Lightbringer and Preston now as ASIOF seems to be dominated by w**kers who insist THEY KNOW MORE THAN ANYONE about GoT these days and Elio and Linda seem huffy since they lost the gig on Sky.
Do you like Hobbs as well?
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I used to post on Westeros. org a couple of years back... not a huge Hobbs fan.
Who needs to go anywhere but ROF for w**kers who insist they know more than anyone else?
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I just saw a dara o brien tweet expressing surprise that bronn is jerome off of robson and jerome. htf did anyone not know that?
I was on a train back from the rugby to guildford once and he was in the same carriage. "you're jerome" said. "i know" he replied. I got everyone singing unchained melody at him. he didn't look amused. I may have had a few sherberts...
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Heh
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Heh
I was watching batman begins with the nippers yesterday, batman was giving a gadget to a random kid and I suddenly found myself shouting OMFG IT'S F'ING JOFFREY, KILL HIM BATMAN BEFORE ITS TOO LATE
Fs only in my head of course
Nippers were a bit bemused
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