Because he's one of the few remaining actual Tories?
Gosh, sonny, pull up a chair and allow me the time to remember. I'm old enough to remember when the tories were a party of considered growth, and steady evolution of the state to offer opportunities to those who worked for them and gently level the playing field. A party that encouraged investment and modern values, but still respectfully holding to tradition.
I even voted for them a few times. But then they fell in with the wrong crowd and took to drugs and populism and baby fascism.
Sounds like ??? had a bit of trouble going toe to toe with the intellectual powerhouse that Macfarlanes is (or at least was during Gauke's and at least one poster on here's time).
It is not particularly logical for small "c" conservatives to join the Lib Dems, and it is not necessarily helpful for the Lib Dems to accept them (or Labour exiles, for that matter).
Unfortunately we have a political system where size and strength matter. If your party is too small or its supporters are too spread out over a wide geographical area, you don't get a look in. The Lib Dems have managed to boost their numbers in this parliament by welcoming almost any disgrunted Labour or Tory MP into their ranks, but it means that a significant number of their MPs are representing constituencies which did not elect a Lib Dem MP. Where those MPs are personally very popular with their constituents and represent a remain constituency, they might manage to get re-elected as Lib Dems in December. But I suspect most of those constituencies will return a different MP representing the party they voted for last time.
I'm all for political parties being a broach church within reason, and I can see the logic behind both Labour and the Conservatives being parties where most of their members are broadly aligned on most political issues but counting both Brexiters and remainers among their ranks. But the Lib Dems have become the opposite.
When you welcome Luciana Berger and Angela Smith on the one hand, and Philip Lee and Sarah Wollaston on the other, what exactly do you stand for? Those politicians are not broadly aligned on most issues; they are broadly opposed on most issues. The only thing they really have in common is their desire to stop Brexit. And one of them (Sarah Wollaston) was originally pro Brexit, so I assume she is not actually pro EU or ideologically opposed to Brexit, but just doesn't think leaving the EU can be done without causing an unacceptable level of damage.
I think it would be better for all concerned if those who have left Labour or the Tories agreed to work with the Lib Dems and others who are worried about Brexit, whilst remaining independent. MPs such as Anna Soubry and Rory Stewart understand this. I just wish they would all contest their current seats as independents and try to get re-elected on their own merits (rather than standing for the Lib Dems or standing down) because many of them are good MPs and Parliament is better and stronger for their presence. I fear we will lose a lot of the good ones on 12th December.
anyway, enough of such sensibleness. The mighty tory election machine will shortly deliver an increase in seats, in their 4th successive election as the largest party.
I think it would be better for all concerned if those who have left Labour or the Tories had allowed by-elections to take place so their constituents could promptly show what they thought of such moves.
Also shows that they are running scared, because Reckless and Carswell proved you can win those by elections if your constituency genuinely supports you. Indeed Carswell got re-elected as a UKIP MP at a General Election despite the best efforts of the Tory Party to dislodge him.
I just wish they would all contest their current seats as independents and try to get re-elected on their own merits (rather than standing for the Lib Dems or standing down) because many of them are good MPs and Parliament is better and stronger for their presence. I fear we will lose a lot of the good ones on 12th December.
The issue is a lack of party machinery though. Its a relatively small group of active party members who do the door knocking, arrange the posters, telling, go round collecting the old biddies, etc. Plus its then all out of your own pocket for the campaign.
You won't have access to the database to show you which houses are actually worth spending time on (unless you get friendly local chairman to act illegally).
Under GDPR you can't, as an independent, even steal the old mailing list and use it.
Trying to go it as an independent is going to be really hard unless you have the old local party solidly behind you. Much, much easier if you can drop into the Lib Dems and take advantage of their local infrastructure.
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Because he's one of the few remaining actual Tories?
Gosh, sonny, pull up a chair and allow me the time to remember. I'm old enough to remember when the tories were a party of considered growth, and steady evolution of the state to offer opportunities to those who worked for them and gently level the playing field. A party that encouraged investment and modern values, but still respectfully holding to tradition.
I even voted for them a few times. But then they fell in with the wrong crowd and took to drugs and populism and baby fascism.
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He's telling everyone else to vote Liberal so why doesn't he stand in their interest?
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Tbf the steward at National Liberal Club is a rather burly looking Saffer. Probably refused him entry
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Why don't you write him a nice long letter and ask?
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Did 6 yrs at Macfarlanes. Everyone I know there (1 person) is sound so he must be alright.
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Good sample of opinion.
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I know one person there. Disproves your theory.
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That's 2 to 1. Odds favouring that he's a total bell end.
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Sounds like ??? had a bit of trouble going toe to toe with the intellectual powerhouse that Macfarlanes is (or at least was during Gauke's and at least one poster on here's time).
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heh @ brexit party operatives getting riled up here
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Macfarlanes are exceptional
I've been instructed by them on a number of occasions and they are without fail charming, intelligent and efficient
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what buzz said at 18.46
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What Jellymonster said.
It is not particularly logical for small "c" conservatives to join the Lib Dems, and it is not necessarily helpful for the Lib Dems to accept them (or Labour exiles, for that matter).
Unfortunately we have a political system where size and strength matter. If your party is too small or its supporters are too spread out over a wide geographical area, you don't get a look in. The Lib Dems have managed to boost their numbers in this parliament by welcoming almost any disgrunted Labour or Tory MP into their ranks, but it means that a significant number of their MPs are representing constituencies which did not elect a Lib Dem MP. Where those MPs are personally very popular with their constituents and represent a remain constituency, they might manage to get re-elected as Lib Dems in December. But I suspect most of those constituencies will return a different MP representing the party they voted for last time.
I'm all for political parties being a broach church within reason, and I can see the logic behind both Labour and the Conservatives being parties where most of their members are broadly aligned on most political issues but counting both Brexiters and remainers among their ranks. But the Lib Dems have become the opposite.
When you welcome Luciana Berger and Angela Smith on the one hand, and Philip Lee and Sarah Wollaston on the other, what exactly do you stand for? Those politicians are not broadly aligned on most issues; they are broadly opposed on most issues. The only thing they really have in common is their desire to stop Brexit. And one of them (Sarah Wollaston) was originally pro Brexit, so I assume she is not actually pro EU or ideologically opposed to Brexit, but just doesn't think leaving the EU can be done without causing an unacceptable level of damage.
I think it would be better for all concerned if those who have left Labour or the Tories agreed to work with the Lib Dems and others who are worried about Brexit, whilst remaining independent. MPs such as Anna Soubry and Rory Stewart understand this. I just wish they would all contest their current seats as independents and try to get re-elected on their own merits (rather than standing for the Lib Dems or standing down) because many of them are good MPs and Parliament is better and stronger for their presence. I fear we will lose a lot of the good ones on 12th December.
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ahem.
I shall say this only once.
what lady p said
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Heh. I'm pretty sure you've said that before, Clubbers.
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anyway, enough of such sensibleness. The mighty tory election machine will shortly deliver an increase in seats, in their 4th successive election as the largest party.
what a feat
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I think it would be better for all concerned if those who have left Labour or the Tories had allowed by-elections to take place so their constituents could promptly show what they thought of such moves.
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Indeed, and recently the only people who've allowed a People's vlVote in those circs were UKIPers (Reckless and Carswell).
Says a lot about Remainers, frankly.
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Also shows that they are running scared, because Reckless and Carswell proved you can win those by elections if your constituency genuinely supports you. Indeed Carswell got re-elected as a UKIP MP at a General Election despite the best efforts of the Tory Party to dislodge him.
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I too am with Lady P on this...
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I just wish they would all contest their current seats as independents and try to get re-elected on their own merits (rather than standing for the Lib Dems or standing down) because many of them are good MPs and Parliament is better and stronger for their presence. I fear we will lose a lot of the good ones on 12th December.
The issue is a lack of party machinery though. Its a relatively small group of active party members who do the door knocking, arrange the posters, telling, go round collecting the old biddies, etc. Plus its then all out of your own pocket for the campaign.
You won't have access to the database to show you which houses are actually worth spending time on (unless you get friendly local chairman to act illegally).
Under GDPR you can't, as an independent, even steal the old mailing list and use it.
Trying to go it as an independent is going to be really hard unless you have the old local party solidly behind you. Much, much easier if you can drop into the Lib Dems and take advantage of their local infrastructure.
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