Complaining that her son’s birth certificate was put into the public domain.
Birth certificates have been in the public domain since 1837.
She’s really quite thick, isn’t she? Seems to be a requirement for Deputy Leaders these days.
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What does lack intelligence is to equate lack of knowledge of something specific with lack of intelligence.
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It’s disingenuous. Classic millennial tactic they seem to think they invented.
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Are these millennials in the room with us?
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The incident occurred last month. She’s had weeks to look up something that anyone with Google could do in seconds.
But Guy thinks the next Deputy Prime Minister need not concern themselves with such things.
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As long as she knows how to administer a colossal thrashing to the corrupt, thieving tozzpieces then I am tuglite about her knowledge of birth certificate trivia.
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She knows how to be on message and blame everything on the Conservative Party. She’s the new John Prescott.
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Sounds like she is doing her job well.
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I think it is more or less fair to blame everything on the Conservative party, there are not many problems in this country they have not either created or made worse in the last 14 years.
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She’s a self serving vulgar opportunist and will have to tack centre and stop talking about her ginger growler if she wants to keep her job next year.
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Well done for looking something up that you didn't know and then pointing out that someone else didn't know it.
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Happy Birthday Angela Rayner!
On her intelligence.. it takes a lot of cleverness to go from being a teenage single mum on a council estate to deputy leader of the political party that is about to become the most powerful government of our history.
And one day we will be calling her Baroness Rayner, believe me.
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she probably has fcuked this up a bit
but it's easy to do and she should just say something like "I looked into it retrospectively with my advisor and paid the £3000 we calculated is due"
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Unfortunately she's a normal person and hasn't kept all of her records from fifteen years ago to confirm what was done.
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Am I the next Deputy Prime Minister? If this was the Tory equivalent you wouldn’t be excusing their stupidity.
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No Barney I wouldn't as most people have no idea about the accessibility of birth certificates apart from watching Day of the Jackal. Might have a point if they were the minister in charge of the relevant department who'd just approved a new process for making them available.
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She’s a good and smart person and correct in all political matters and she is soon going to be home secretary wielding a megamadge 450.
Of course she gets stick for being a woman and working class and northern, and not ashamed to have opinions despite all of the above. Amusing to watch the middle aged gammons froth.
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So every time a Labour minister says something stupid we’re cool with it. Fair enough but every time a Conservative minister says something dumb, the Centrist Dads are all over it like a rash..
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Keep digging
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Same issue as with Diane Abbot, if you working class or a woman or black and make a factual mistake everyone calls you stupid. If you are an old etonian white man it is an understandable slip and no reflection on their intelligence which is demonstrated with latin tags and classical references.
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So every time a Labour minister says something stupid we’re cool with it.
Yes, because it is a rarer occurrence than the old Etonian loons who seem to have lost touch with reality in their pursuit of trumpism uk.
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birth certificates are publicly available but they include personal data and therefore are likely to be subject to data protection rules from various different sources
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I’m not aware of anyone from LAB saying anything stupid, ever, so it’s n/a
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They are not asking for her records, they are asking for a copy of the advice confirming she has done nothing wrong. She doesnt want to give it because tories dont have to. Well that was what she argued, and something about her family being set upon by people having access to her kids birth certificate. She would do better just explaining what happened, and then it becomes a non issue.
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“So every time a Labour minister says something stupid we’re cool with it. Fair enough but every time a Conservative minister says something dumb, the Centrist Dads are all over it like a rash..”
Yes correct, and rightly so - that’s what they get for having absolutely gutted britain, socially and economically, for a frankly unbelievable decade and a half (that so many people voted conservative in 2019 is one of the greatest acts of collective idiocy in human history).
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Barney give over you fvcking melt.
What she was complaining about was clearly the decision by various of the GUTTER PRESS to plaster personal details about her family all over their grimy little chip wrappers.
Context sale ---------------------------->
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Barney it depends if it's genuinely stupid or something that most normal people wouldn't know. I'll be the first to admit that there are plenty of politicians with no understanding of how reality works especially all those who frequently object to being asked to provide receipts for the expenses they claim.
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Have to lol @ this whole saga. Have all MPs forgotten the expenses scandal? If I were Rayner I would say that’s fine, I’ll publish when the entire Tory front bench publish their tax returns for the past 10 years. There will be countless incidents of gaming the primary residence exemption, pretty much guaranteed non-declaration of interest pre-PSA introduction etc.
Ultimately this is sneering trustafarians victimising someone that’s reflective of most people I would say - battling a form laden vindictive tax system that lets corporations and bent well advised rich people off the hook routinely while pursuing plumbers for a few £k in VAT. That being said, she should just come clean on that basis.
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Barney28 Mar 24 09:39
.... but every time a Conservative minister says something dumb, the Centrist Dads are all over it like a rash..
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not every time, can you imagine how exhausting it would be to keep up with that!
I kinda also find it baffling how the tories and the meatshields have gone nuts at "leftie lawyers" and "centrist dads", I'm pretty sure they can't win an election without these sorts of voters
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wood though. many times.
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All I will say is that she annoys the right people.
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To be fair - it is amusing to see the double standards. People who I suspect were - rightly - all over Zahawi and other Tories - coming up with the lamest excuses for Rayner.
Its not the quantum - its a serious issue of integrity and competence if senior politicians cannot get their taxes right and 'accidentally' save on their taxes. Its not even that complicated. I checked it once as Mrs Worf has a share in a separate property - took all of 2 minutes to discover that as a married couple you only get PPR Exemption. You might even be better placed if divorced. Which is arse about tit but there you go.
Her responses were classic crafted responses fed into by PR and Lawyers (I do wonder If Mr Neidle took a little look?). Lots of distraction and 'think of the children' BS - but all very vague and evasive on the actual issue relevant to tax avoidance. It seems clear she had no clue or was deliberately blind to the rules. Someone (Mr Neidle?) has pointed out some basic truths: if your weren't there you had to pay tax but only on any gain above the annual allowance, so if you spent more than about £35K on it you are fine. She has read that as "Ive been advised no tax was due" because she believes she will have spent about that over the years. But the problem is that it is a bit like her prior belief that it was her primary residence - its wishful thinking and probably not factually true. But murky enough to maybe hope it goes away because obviously nobody keeps receipts. Unlike her belief in her residence - which was obviously going to blow up right away as there is going to just be too much evidence of where someone actually fooking lives - she might get away with it. That said theres no evidence of major works I dont think - and £35K is a large amount to spend on minor stuff on a council house over a few years, so if anyone digs, I suspect this blows up too.
Even if her gain was only a bit over the CGT Annual Allowance, she ends up with some sort of proportional calculation and possibly a modest CGT bill on the excess - which she hasn't paid and will have misreported. They know the press will - rightly - have field day when this get out. It clearly goes to integrity and competence. I suspect however she will survive as the amount will be very small and she will just plead ignorance and in the court of public opinion (where all important issues are tried nowadays) will sympathise.
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I agree with worf. She’ll probably get away with it. Feels a bit like when Mandelson lied on his mortgage application
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" in the court of public opinion (where all important issues are tried nowadays) "
As they have been since the dawn of man.
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this is great, the tories who have spaffed the entire treasury over to their mates have managed to get a story that Angela Rayner may or may not owe a couple of grand in CGT as the first item on the agenda.
Meanwhile "Baroness" Mone sits on her second yacht enjoying our money.
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Canary Worf28 Mar 24 11:00
To be fair - it is amusing to see the double standards. People who I suspect were - rightly - all over Zahawi and other Tories - coming up with the lamest excuses for Rayner.
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I kinda disagree Worf, cause I can see how this confusion has come up;
Here’s what appears to have happened, based on press reports and Angela Rayner’s statement:
Rayner says “As with the majority of ordinary people who sell their own homes, I was not liable for capital gains tax because it was my home and the only one I owned.”
This, however, isn’t how the rules work. Married couples can only have one principal residence for CGT purposes. A married couple who own more than one home are free to choose which is their “principal residence” for CGT purposes by sending a nomination to HMRC within two years of the situation arising.
I suspect many people would find every part of this surprising. Most taxation works by reference to individuals, so it’s odd this rule allows only one principal residence per married couple. Odder still that marriage potentially creates a big tax disadvantage. And even more curious that you are free to choose which property is your “principal residence” without reference to whether it really is. It’s therefore hard to blame Ms Rayner for misunderstanding the rules.
(from Did Angela Rayner fail to pay CGT on her house sale? (taxpolicy.org.uk))
any from the comments
comparing to Zahawi, I think that was a gibraltar trust set up to own his yougov shares and there was a long running series of lies and what not about him being investigated about it (he saved something like 4 million in CGT)
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Not sure everybody who benefitted from furlough was a mate of the Conservative Party
Nor sure everybody who benefitted from the energy subsidies were mates of the Conservative Party
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totally agree the tories are egregiously worse at this stuff - doesnt give a pass though - keep the discipline and ensure there isnt a slip into the tories orbit.
She should apologies, fess up and take her knock - its a small amount but sets the cultural expectation in the future government that integrity matters.
Mone belongs in jail as does zahawi - this minor event will not change my voting pattern but we dont have to be so tribal to sweep it under the rug either - its a small offense that needs a small redress and thats it.
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Centrist Dad here. She’s as much of a tosspot as those Etonian pricks.
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This.
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Is it possible for old etonians to also be centrist dads?
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Isn’t Rory Stewart the godfather of centrist daddism?
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I would apply the same standard to everyone. In our family in the last year people have had to pay CGT because of similar issues - lots of law abiding people do in situations like AR's situation where you buy a property and your new spouse or partner has one too and there are SDLT issues and I think in her case something about having bought a council house at a discount. Whilst the rest of us including Labour and Tory voters spend ages complying with the law no one should disobey it. Also you have duties to give correct addresses eg on the electoral register. Just because you are working class or female or upper class does not mean the law does not apply.
I think all people want is to ensure she followed the law and if not is penalised like the rest of us would be.
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Who leaked it anyway?
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It is possible she:
Hasn’t paid cgt owed
Has collected rent without paying income tax on it
Has broken the terms of the ‘right to buy’ agreement she signed
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