Supposedly she is planning to reinvent herself as a Thatcher-like standard bearer for the low-tax, small state economy that she and lots of Tories think is the answer. She may be right on that but she ain’t the person to lead that crusade.
And I lolled when I heard she was planning a major speech soon setting this out. Because of course her legendary oratory is bound to rouse millions to support her.
It's not so much her (though she is extremely weird and awkward) but her lunatic low-tax policies for "growth" which turned the UK into a Third World country.
Needs to find her level.
I think she’d make a reasonably good clerk for a rural parish council somewhere
yes she might occasionally lock all of the minutes in the boot of the car and drop her key down a drain. Or give all of the parish funds to a wealthy Nigerian general suffering a temporary cash flow crisis. But that sort of stuff goes on all the time in local government, I think she’d be forgiven.
🦆🦆🦆 it is the brexit cult turning the UK into a 3rd world country. Laying it all at the feet of the lettuce is convenient but false. She and Kwarteng did accelerate the descent a bit though.
Rubbish. While leaving the Single Market has damaged the economy, "Trussonomics" brought it to its knees. Without a doubt, the worst Prime Minister in history.
The wealthiest countries in Europe with the highest productivity have high taxes and government spending levels. Truss and her ilk are simply wrong, both in theory and of course in practice.
Lol@that fvcking moron 3dux trying to disassociate himself from this. I didn't want this type of brexit! Also I didn't want a confirmatory referendum on the final deal that was available!
You and every other brexiteer own the calamatous last 7 years you stupid khunt.
Truss' long term gift to the country is to bury the myth of tax cutting our way out of trouble for a generation. It was painful but in the long term may have been worth it to shut these fools up.
Low tax small government does not work, Brexit did not work - you had your chance and screwed it -now the whole lot of you fook off for twenty years and leave government to gown ups.
Of the recent prime ministers I have met, she was the least impressive. On the other hand, she's the only one I knew at all personally so it may not be a fair comparison.
Cameron, though a good prime minister in many ways, made the worst political decision in British history in his reckless brexit gamble.
At no point have I ever advocated leaving the Single Market, either before the referendum on EU membership (when I was quite vocal about it) or since.
Nor have I ever supported Liz Truss. In fact, I joined the campaign for one of her opponents.
I admit that I retained my membership of the Conservative Party, which is presumably what you are referring to, but did so partly to exercise influence from within, and partly out of misplaced nostalgia. I have since resigned.
Cameron was not a good prime minister - he may have looked and sounded the part and not an obvious lunatic like Johnson and Truss but he made disastrous decisions not only with Brexit but also austerity.
I thought it was a flawed institution with a democratic deficit. I still do. But in the seven years since the referendum, there have been plenty of options to reach a resolution. In principle, I wasn't even against a confirmatory referendum which put those various options to the people, including a Customs Union and rejoining the Single Market.
At no point have I ever advocated leaving the Single Market, either before the referendum on EU membership (when I was quite vocal about it) or since’
probably shouldn’t have voted leave then (and then voted for Boris). It was clearly set out in the infamous leaflet that we would leave the single market…
there’s no value howling about the manifold other options a couple of which definitely definitely might/would have made brexit a success, when almost all of them were neither practically nor politically nor democratically nor philosophically available. nor were they guaranteed 2 make brexit a success
the point is u were told this at the time and u still voted. threep is saying u have 2 own that. u cannot hide behind claiming that others didn’t do it how u wanted it, cos how u wanted it was not on the ballot
history will be kind (4 want of a better expression) 2 truss in the sense that it will recognise that while she was totally and utterly incompetent and a disaster, it was her immedi6 predecessor and his lackeys who truly damaged the country lastingly
the proof of that is that rishi quickly undid most of the damage truss achieved, and has merely restored britain 2 bodge level basket case
the bizarre "campaign" where her and sunak and mordaunt gaslit the press into somehow believing an election was taking place was one of the strangest episodes in the strange last decade of british politics
she's just so weird and the idea that britain would elect someone that overtly weird if given any say is unserious
Heh @ poor little hyoobert’s desperate attempts to be an edgelord on this thread.
Weekend quiet as always is it hyoobert?
2bf 2 my m7 unkle hyoo, his response is consistent - the point is he has a different calibration of successful outcome.
u have 2 remember that he is really bitter about how he feels the world has unfairly treated him. he specifically wanted brexit 2 c britain burn. so in that context, there’s nothing contrary or irrational about claiming truss got it right
OK I accept that, in voting Leave, I should have foreseen the possibility that we would also leave the single market. I didn't. In fact it never occurred to me that the government wouldn't just accept that as the natural default position. It's unfortunate that any attempt at compromise or any nuanced perspective was rendered impossible due to polarisation. But there we go. Would I vote the same way again, knowing that? Not sure tbh. Probably. But the whole thing is pretty depressing.
One of the problems we now have is the complete polarisation of politics.
It’s almost all the fault of the alt right but remainers (like me) would do well to remember that we need to bring moderates (and he is one) like Dux with us if things are going to get better.
Its a full on fight for democracy and our future both culturally and economically depends on us persuading those previously open to persuasion To alt right ideas to not make the same mistake again.
dux seriously, in all that has happened in what way do you think life in this country is better because of Brexit? I am quite surprised given what you post that you still do not regret Brexit.
For me it's a question of principle, but if, as you say, it doesn't matter to most people, then why doesn't the government (or at least the Labour opposition) propose a compromise solution?
OK I accept that, in voting Leave, I should have foreseen the possibility that we would also leave the single market. I didn't. In fact it never occurred to me that the government wouldn't just accept that as the natural default position. It's unfortunate that any attempt at compromise or any nuanced perspective was rendered impossible due to polarisation. But there we go. Would I vote the same way again, knowing that? Not sure tbh. Probably. But the whole thing is pretty depressing.
fairy nuff
i’m mildly surprised by the “probably”, but otherwise that’s a fair and honest appraisal.
and we can agree on the last sentence. tho admittedly i should b sympathetic as u don’t get the epicaricacy of “i told u so”
By the way I would have been to see Truss carry on and for the UK to succeed, which it would have. Not here to laugh at failures, except of course strutter.
Of course Liberals will excuse Truss and blame Brexit. They are just as ardent as she is in their love of Free Trade.
balanced free trade has lifted billions out of poverty. there’s a massive difference between pragmatic balance/steady evolution and extremist free trade puritanism
Supposedly she is planning to reinvent herself as a Thatcher-like standard bearer for the low-tax, small state economy that she and lots of Tories think is the answer.
She did that whole bit once already; it didn't work out so well.
If at first you don't succeed...then please have the decency to fark 'orf with your stale old disproven ideas.
Dux you sh1t on about "sovereignty" and "democratic deficit", both of which would have been undermined by a Brexit that left us in the single market.
Answer the question without meaningless soundbites: in 2016 how did you imagine that a Brexit that left us in the SM and so subject to the rules of the various EU institutions which Britons no longer democratically contributed to, would possibly in any way increase our "sovereignty" or reduce the "democratic deficit"?
I mean let's go from a position where our elected officials (elected under a much more democratic voting system than our domestic one) largely write EU rules and regulations to having to abide by them but have no say in their content, that'll sort out the ol' democratic deficit
Answer the question without meaningless soundbites: in 2016 how did you imagine that a Brexit that left us in the SM and so subject to the rules of the various EU institutions which Britons no longer democratically contributed to, would possibly in any way increase our "sovereignty" or reduce the "democratic deficit"?
that’s it, eh - superficially those self confidence levels sound appealing, but a moments thought and it’s obvious that a fundamental pre-requisite 2 achieving those levels is complete delusion
I AM PROUD TO SAY THAT I AM THE KIND OF PERSON WHO FINDS LIZ TRUSS IMPRESSIVE AND THINKS SHE FULLY DESERVED TO BE THE PRIME MINISTER OF THIS GREAT NATION!!
that’s it, eh - superficially those self confidence levels sound appealing, but a moments thought and it’s obvious that a fundamental pre-requisite 2 achieving those levels is complete delusion
Unfortunately, the current zeitgeist (not just in politics, but for public figures of many kinds) is all about projecting the cast iron self confidence and charisma of the cult leader.
Nuance, caveats, and the admission of areas of doubt will get often you booted in favour of someone with a more emotionally compelling story to tell.
I'm not sure what it's all about. The desire for certainty in an increasingly uncertain world perhaps?
It's not self-confidence. It's a bone-headed refusal to listen to any other point of view, nuance, reason, or to think critically (or at all). Also a refusal to engage with anyone other than people who egg you on unreservedly. Underneath, there is probably a lack of confidence, lack of empathy, and not a lot of intelligence.
That was the year of the Festival of Britain, the year that most rationing ended, the year that the term "rock and roll" was coined. It was quite an eventful and forward-looking year, all said.
Also, the article suggests that her hard Right ideas distanced herself from her earlier Liberalism, whereas in fact they were an extreme manifestation of it. She is very much from the school of Liberalism of Arthur Seldon, an early Thatcherite.
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Leader of the reform party by the next election.
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Supposedly she is planning to reinvent herself as a Thatcher-like standard bearer for the low-tax, small state economy that she and lots of Tories think is the answer. She may be right on that but she ain’t the person to lead that crusade.
And I lolled when I heard she was planning a major speech soon setting this out. Because of course her legendary oratory is bound to rouse millions to support her.
#porkmarkets
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She has my vote.
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It's not so much her (though she is extremely weird and awkward) but her lunatic low-tax policies for "growth" which turned the UK into a Third World country.
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Needs to find her level.
I think she’d make a reasonably good clerk for a rural parish council somewhere
yes she might occasionally lock all of the minutes in the boot of the car and drop her key down a drain. Or give all of the parish funds to a wealthy Nigerian general suffering a temporary cash flow crisis. But that sort of stuff goes on all the time in local government, I think she’d be forgiven.
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🦆🦆🦆 it is the brexit cult turning the UK into a 3rd world country. Laying it all at the feet of the lettuce is convenient but false. She and Kwarteng did accelerate the descent a bit though.
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Coincided with Risky's return? - spooky!
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The sheer brass neck of these people defies belief - she should leave politics immediately and think on her sins
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Rubbish. While leaving the Single Market has damaged the economy, "Trussonomics" brought it to its knees. Without a doubt, the worst Prime Minister in history.
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Lowering taxes was utter madness. Even billionaire Sunak thought so.
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Downside for you Dix is she was right.
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If you wanted to completely discredit a movement or organisation you would probably get Liz truss to front it
and she’s a former Lib Dem remainer you say….
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‘Downside for you Dix is she was right’
That must be why she’s enjoying a long and glorious reign as PM
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The wealthiest countries in Europe with the highest productivity have high taxes and government spending levels. Truss and her ilk are simply wrong, both in theory and of course in practice.
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Right about what?
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Yeah maybe. Someone should try it and see what happens.
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Lol@that fvcking moron 3dux trying to disassociate himself from this. I didn't want this type of brexit! Also I didn't want a confirmatory referendum on the final deal that was available!
You and every other brexiteer own the calamatous last 7 years you stupid khunt.
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Heh @ poor little hyoobert’s desperate attempts to be an edgelord on this thread.
Weekend quiet as always is it hyoobert?
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Truss' long term gift to the country is to bury the myth of tax cutting our way out of trouble for a generation. It was painful but in the long term may have been worth it to shut these fools up.
Low tax small government does not work, Brexit did not work - you had your chance and screwed it -now the whole lot of you fook off for twenty years and leave government to gown ups.
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Of the recent prime ministers I have met, she was the least impressive. On the other hand, she's the only one I knew at all personally so it may not be a fair comparison.
Cameron, though a good prime minister in many ways, made the worst political decision in British history in his reckless brexit gamble.
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At no point have I ever advocated leaving the Single Market, either before the referendum on EU membership (when I was quite vocal about it) or since.
Nor have I ever supported Liz Truss. In fact, I joined the campaign for one of her opponents.
I admit that I retained my membership of the Conservative Party, which is presumably what you are referring to, but did so partly to exercise influence from within, and partly out of misplaced nostalgia. I have since resigned.
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Cameron was not a good prime minister - he may have looked and sounded the part and not an obvious lunatic like Johnson and Truss but he made disastrous decisions not only with Brexit but also austerity.
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i think he’s getting more at ur original support of brexit
remoaners sed at the time it would either be really shit or really really shit
u don’t get 2 excuse that that has panned out exactly as predicted, if not worse, just cos u have turned against 1 of the policy implementers
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I thought it was a flawed institution with a democratic deficit. I still do. But in the seven years since the referendum, there have been plenty of options to reach a resolution. In principle, I wasn't even against a confirmatory referendum which put those various options to the people, including a Customs Union and rejoining the Single Market.
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She didn’t actually lower any taxes at all though. The reductions described were all planned to be implemented this April following Obr review.
there then followed an artificial flash crash. Lots of people made huge sums of money from that
the Bank of England itself made profits in that four week period that almost doubled the cost of the 45p tax cut.
Jeremy Hunt will lower tax likely in the same amounts this year.
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At no point have I ever advocated leaving the Single Market, either before the referendum on EU membership (when I was quite vocal about it) or since’
probably shouldn’t have voted leave then (and then voted for Boris). It was clearly set out in the infamous leaflet that we would leave the single market…
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And just look at this ferret, it goes backwards as well as forwards!
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‘an artificial flash crash‘
😂
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that is still purposefully missing the point
there’s no value howling about the manifold other options a couple of which definitely definitely might/would have made brexit a success, when almost all of them were neither practically nor politically nor democratically nor philosophically available. nor were they guaranteed 2 make brexit a success
the point is u were told this at the time and u still voted. threep is saying u have 2 own that. u cannot hide behind claiming that others didn’t do it how u wanted it, cos how u wanted it was not on the ballot
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history will be kind (4 want of a better expression) 2 truss in the sense that it will recognise that while she was totally and utterly incompetent and a disaster, it was her immedi6 predecessor and his lackeys who truly damaged the country lastingly
the proof of that is that rishi quickly undid most of the damage truss achieved, and has merely restored britain 2 bodge level basket case
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the bizarre "campaign" where her and sunak and mordaunt gaslit the press into somehow believing an election was taking place was one of the strangest episodes in the strange last decade of british politics
she's just so weird and the idea that britain would elect someone that overtly weird if given any say is unserious
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There are no second acts in
Oh
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2bf 2 my m7 unkle hyoo, his response is consistent - the point is he has a different calibration of successful outcome.
u have 2 remember that he is really bitter about how he feels the world has unfairly treated him. he specifically wanted brexit 2 c britain burn. so in that context, there’s nothing contrary or irrational about claiming truss got it right
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OK I accept that, in voting Leave, I should have foreseen the possibility that we would also leave the single market. I didn't. In fact it never occurred to me that the government wouldn't just accept that as the natural default position. It's unfortunate that any attempt at compromise or any nuanced perspective was rendered impossible due to polarisation. But there we go. Would I vote the same way again, knowing that? Not sure tbh. Probably. But the whole thing is pretty depressing.
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Of course Liberals will excuse Truss and blame Brexit. They are just as ardent as she is in their love of Free Trade.
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Team 3 Dux here mostly..
One of the problems we now have is the complete polarisation of politics.
It’s almost all the fault of the alt right but remainers (like me) would do well to remember that we need to bring moderates (and he is one) like Dux with us if things are going to get better.
Its a full on fight for democracy and our future both culturally and economically depends on us persuading those previously open to persuasion To alt right ideas to not make the same mistake again.
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dux seriously, in all that has happened in what way do you think life in this country is better because of Brexit? I am quite surprised given what you post that you still do not regret Brexit.
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I think I adopt the same view as the vast majority of the public: that a trading bloc, and one which allows free movement of people, is desirable.
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but the difference between that and being in the EU is far smaller than the difference between that and what we have now.
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For me it's a question of principle, but if, as you say, it doesn't matter to most people, then why doesn't the government (or at least the Labour opposition) propose a compromise solution?
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Heartening to see so many of you happy to pay high taxes. Keep it up!
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fairy nuff
i’m mildly surprised by the “probably”, but otherwise that’s a fair and honest appraisal.
and we can agree on the last sentence. tho admittedly i should b sympathetic as u don’t get the epicaricacy of “i told u so”
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By the way I would have been to see Truss carry on and for the UK to succeed, which it would have. Not here to laugh at failures, except of course strutter.
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balanced free trade has lifted billions out of poverty. there’s a massive difference between pragmatic balance/steady evolution and extremist free trade puritanism
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Just heh.
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trouble was Truss was that she believes in free markets making the best judgments but sadly the free market did not believe in her.
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Anyone claiming truss was right about anything is a moron, she is the wrongest person in history
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She did that whole bit once already; it didn't work out so well.
If at first you don't succeed...then please have the decency to fark 'orf with your stale old disproven ideas.
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Dux you sh1t on about "sovereignty" and "democratic deficit", both of which would have been undermined by a Brexit that left us in the single market.
Answer the question without meaningless soundbites: in 2016 how did you imagine that a Brexit that left us in the SM and so subject to the rules of the various EU institutions which Britons no longer democratically contributed to, would possibly in any way increase our "sovereignty" or reduce the "democratic deficit"?
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and good bothsidesing there, dickhead
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I dont think trans ever went away
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I mean let's go from a position where our elected officials (elected under a much more democratic voting system than our domestic one) largely write EU rules and regulations to having to abide by them but have no say in their content, that'll sort out the ol' democratic deficit
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Why must you be so rude and personal?
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If she makes a comeback there should be a sniper waiting on the road in.
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Why must you vote to make more kids go hungry? Sorry if I hurt your feelings.
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He is a duckhead, not a dickhead, hth
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the penis gently swaying from his left temple begs 2 differ 🫡
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The sado-masochism involved would be consistent with her previous behaviour. Surely rof’s subs can comment on this?
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What I’d give for her levels of self-confidence
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Just in case you missed this Dux
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Frothy frothy
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Thankfully, not everyone is endowed with such an efficient personal reality distortion field, or the world would already be a smoking ruin.
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that’s it, eh - superficially those self confidence levels sound appealing, but a moments thought and it’s obvious that a fundamental pre-requisite 2 achieving those levels is complete delusion
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I AM PROUD TO SAY THAT I AM THE KIND OF PERSON WHO FINDS LIZ TRUSS IMPRESSIVE AND THINKS SHE FULLY DESERVED TO BE THE PRIME MINISTER OF THIS GREAT NATION!!
THAT IS WHO I AM!!
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Unfortunately, the current zeitgeist (not just in politics, but for public figures of many kinds) is all about projecting the cast iron self confidence and charisma of the cult leader.
Nuance, caveats, and the admission of areas of doubt will get often you booted in favour of someone with a more emotionally compelling story to tell.
I'm not sure what it's all about. The desire for certainty in an increasingly uncertain world perhaps?
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No it’s because social media and reality tv have reduced people to gibbons.
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You seem quite certain of that take, Bertha.
And we're on a form of social media now ... wait, perhaps you're right.
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IT WAS THE ANTI-GROWTH COALITION!!! THAT TORPEDOED LIZ'S LOW TAX TRUE TORY BUDGET!!!
BRING LIZ BACK! AND SORT OUT THE NAYSAYERS!!!
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Truss was right that change requires radical action. What she got wrong was thinking she had done enough to sell it.
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SO TRUE!!
SHE JUST NEEDED TO EXPLAIN IT BETTER!!
THAT’S WHAT WAS WRONG!!
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It's not self-confidence. It's a bone-headed refusal to listen to any other point of view, nuance, reason, or to think critically (or at all). Also a refusal to engage with anyone other than people who egg you on unreservedly. Underneath, there is probably a lack of confidence, lack of empathy, and not a lot of intelligence.
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Truss-Europe Express
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In dust we truss
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Good article on the Truss:
"There is something intensely prosaic and unimaginative about Truss: if she were a year, she would be 1951."
https://www.politico.eu/article/liz-truss-uk-prime-minister-ambition-tory-conservatives/
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Why 1951? Bizarre comment.
That was the year of the Festival of Britain, the year that most rationing ended, the year that the term "rock and roll" was coined. It was quite an eventful and forward-looking year, all said.
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Also, the article suggests that her hard Right ideas distanced herself from her earlier Liberalism, whereas in fact they were an extreme manifestation of it. She is very much from the school of Liberalism of Arthur Seldon, an early Thatcherite.
All in all, a poor article.
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Rationing didn’t end until 1954.
Liz Truss is a c unt
Else not a bad try.
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My mistake. Bread and petrol rationing had already ended by '51, and chocolate and sugar not until '53. The rest in '54.
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This be the most prosaic year.
Sex died in 2023.
Just after Liz gave up on the pill
and started HRT.
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