Is there a difference between an unwanted advance and harassment?

I was having this conversation with a date last night - her view was that there was a difference between an unwanted advance and actual harassment - I thought these days, post #metoo there isn't any difference, assuming the person making the pass is in a more senior position?

I think she's right.  Harassment is persisting once it is clear the advance is unwanted, or making an advance when you are in a position of power and influence in relation to the other person. 

 

But it is possible to mis-read the signals and go for an unwanted kiss without it constituting harassment.  Despite what the snowflake brigade would have you believe.

 

Is someone trying to steal your precious seed again, LA?

if you're in the workplace, assume it's always unwanted.  People go to work to work and get money, rather than a middle-guy showing he's a catch to a 24 year old intern.

If you not in the work place, proceed carefully and subtly and take no for an answer, not a setback.

I think technically harassment is supposed to be a repeat pattern of behaviour, so what Badman said about persisting with an unwanted advance once it should be clear that it isn't wanted.

But I'm not sure I agree with that principle. There are some situations in which it should not be necessary to actually make an unwanted advance to know that it is unwanted. You should just know. In those situations even a one off occurrence should be enough to constitute harassment IMO.

Harassment is, as I understand it, a clearly defined statutory thing.

It can occur, relatively uniquely, by virtue of its effect on the object rather than the intention of the subject.

So whether it is in fact harassment is up the harassee.

Obviously there is a difference, otherwise how would anyone initiate any kind of physical contact. 

Is this thread going to descend into "I get consent in writing before touching a woman" by any chance?

It's going to descend into "if you're a qualified lawyer in your 40s with 3 kids, a wife who doesn't understand you, and a lot less hair/more gut than when you were 25 - then perhaps wait for the 24 year old trainee to make the first move."

You should never shit where you eat.

Making a pass at a coworker, more senior, less senior or whatever is always a completely fooking stupid idea, unless its a summer job at a pub.

Obviously there is a difference, otherwise how would anyone initiate any kind of physical contact. 

I suggest the answer is that the kind of people who aren't sure of the difference should err on the side of caution and not engage in any kind of physical contact, thus removing themselves from the gene pool.

"if you're a qualified lawyer in your 40s with 3 kids, a wife who doesn't understand you, and a lot less hair/more gut than when you were 25 - then perhaps wait for the 24 year old trainee to make the first move"

Or, you know, wait until you're divorced rather than cheating on your wife.

I've worked in offices where there were tons of people in relationships. As far as I'm aware, nearly all of them are still married now. I wouldn't do it personally but some people seem to manage fine.

Anna - people do misread signs all the time though and unless we are basically saying that nobody who works together should be proper friends (i.e. friends outside of work) it's not realistic to say that people shouldn't ever make a pass at someone they work with.  

Sadly I think we are getting close to the point where people don't want to be properly friends with those they work with but it makes work so much less pleasant.