Such a weird country. It’s first world economically, on the whole, but it’s legal system, approach to firearms, healthcare system, incarceration rate and prison system and lots of other things are banana republic level.
They can’t be trusted with guns. The aussies brought in bans after Port Arthur, we did it after Dunblane. Seven billion mass shootings later and the NRA still think giving more Americans guns is the answer.
Nah - the main problem is the yanks have a massive fetish for guns. They glorify them. Which is why they are the last civilian population on earth that should be allowed them.
It’s inherent massive mistrust of the state and big government and the only way people think they can protect themselves from all that is to have guns. Plus the constitutional right to bear arms is sacred.
It’s irreversible. How can you ban them when every person owns 6? They’ll just bury them in their gardens then dig them up when they want to go on a mass killing spree.
No offence to my several good American friends. But as a society, the US is sick, and if you want Britain to be more like the US, as our Right of course do; then you want more of this kind of thing here.
obviously incorrect; kindly do not post nonsense again
your beloved brexit will be reversed completely within five years anyway; and this time there’ll be a triple lockah on ever leaving again, a written constitution that starts “BRITAIN IS A MEMBER OF THE EUROPEAN UNION”, and we will immediately join the euro, forego any rebate and agree to QMV on all member state voting
They've got themselves into a turbo-fooked mess and these poor little kids are the victims of nutjobs spouting freedom. This is on the NRA and all their sick followers. There is literally no way out of it though. Even the Dems don't really advocate banning all guns.
I would fkin hate my kids to go to school in the US. How the fk can schools be places which might be the scene of a massacre because of some internet-recluse gimp holding his dad's gun.
a Dem-controlled federal government should organise overnight armed law enforcement raids on every household thought to own a gun. Everywhere across the country simultaneously.
all guns found on premises should be confiscated and destroyed same day
yeah there’s be weeping and greeting and litigation (and probably some shooting) but fook it, those destroyed guns wouldn’t be coming back
Wait until the nutjobs start spouting their conspiracy theory about how this is fake/staged (as they did after Sandy Hook, harassing the grieving parents for perpetrating the "fraud")--that is when you truly despair of humanity.
Australians were just so shocked by the massacre, and the government acted so quickly that it all just kinda happened.
The government introduced the gun reform package legislation in less than two weeks after the massacre. People didn’t really have time to react or organise opposition to it.
Also Australians don’t have any real legal rights (except for the handful set out in our constitution) and certainly no right to bear arms.
So once the govt of the day passed the legislation it was done. There was no possibility of legal challenges.
people whinged and moaned about it .. but nothing really stops anyone from applying for a licence to get a gun if they have a good reason to have one.
I have debated getting one myself but can’t be bothered with the admin.
But the kinds of gun you can own are very very limited, certainly no automatic weapons, and you have to have a licence and store it in certain ways.
The only way this can be sensibly discussed is to preface every debate with the thoughts and sounds of a classroom of 8 year olds being slaughtered one by one.
Fųcking animals. Disgusting stupid, selfish fųcking animals. What a thing to wake up to. Imagine the parents and the thoughts of their little one's deaths haunting them for every waking moment until they die.
I think it's fair to say there is some judicial intellectual dishonesty going on when judges say that the legislators did not intend constitutional amendments to cover abortion, but say "look at the words!*" when asked if the legislators intended the constitution to permit free access to assault rifles.
In the immediate aftermath (when, presumably, their reactions would be as visceral as they are ever going to be) of the murders of 19 children and their teacher, by a kid armed with assault rifles, who had just killed his grandmother, and who shot two law enforcement officers (who happened to be passing by, and are the only reason the death toll isn’t higher), the response from “pro gun” (how is that even a thing?) lawmakers has been “whoa, easy tiger, slow your roll, let’s not get carried away with trying to fix this little “problem” we seem to be having”!
Over the years, these same people will have seen endless footage of devastated parents waiting outside the schools to find out if their kid lived or died. They will have watched surviving children being led out of their school to a world they no longer understand. They will have watched the mass funerals. They will have seen interviews years down the line of bereaved families, surviving children talking about what it is to watch your friends be shot while you scramble to hide or beg for your life. They should have seen enough of these events for their first thought to be “anything, literally any little thing that makes this even a bit less likely has to be worth doing, oh and why does any civilian need an assault rifle anyway, and erm, background checks could be a good thing, you know?” Instead of “but, but, our guns!! they’re well nice, and shiny, and none of our buddies would do anything naughty with them, and that’s what matters, right?”
So yeah, maybe someone needs to make it really real for them, make them listen to the horror and fear, see actual death happening in real time, make them go in with whichever poor people have to collect the bodies and clear the scene, watch the bodies being carried out, see them while they are still warm and very recognisably human and not “unfortunate byproducts” or “collateral damage”.
Because fook all else seems to have worked to change their minds, what else is left?
Its so horrific I can barely process it. Now I have kids I just dont want tonthink about this stuff anymore.
Key practical takeaway:
We need to distance ourselves from the US. Everyone needs to look for opportunities to do so. Ignore their dumb politics and the way it poisons western discourse. Work to get the Tories out. Try to avoid dumb ID politiics. Try to reverse Brexit or get closer to the EU again. The EU is shit in so many ways but leaving it was about getting closer to the US model and we simply dont want to get closer to the US than we already are.
I tend to avoid discussing politics in the real world. But Im trying now to use opportunities to explain to friends and family why I think we need to remove the current Tories from power at all costs.
"No offence to my several good American friends. But as a society, the US is sick, and if you want Britain to be more like the US, as our Right of course do; then you want more of this kind of thing here."
Sir woke, the British right does not want a US approach to gun control. It's juvenile to suggest it does.
You don't even need a ban initially to start dealing with this stuff. Simple legislation requiring guns to be kept locked up at home so teenagers can't just help themselves to them would be a starting point that would help the situation. I can't imagine ever thinking it's fine to leave guns out openly when you've got kids around.
No sign of mental illness no sign of oddness, the only way this massacre could have been prevented is not allowing sales of semi automatic arms to 18 year olds.
Heh CW your aims are diametrically opposed. The tories are the only ones who will stop the pandering to ID politics
u may be right risky. I dislike Id politics and we keep importing more of it from US. But tories tend to do their own version of it and like to keep it brewing as it benefits them electorally.
and tbh if its a choixe between some tedious trans rights threads and american political and economic approaches Ill put up with the former.
Various thick-necked fvckwits doing the rounds telling us the answer is mOrE gUnS iN ScHoOLs
its extraordinary that they get away with claiming restrictions on gun ownership doesn’t work either, look at literally every single other developed nation on earth ffs
The concern is the large amounts of fringe money setting agendas from the US into the UK via Tufton Street etc. The web of creatures of the right who go from student unions to "think tanks" to SPAD jobs or the like is repulsive. Their echo chamber thinking never has the opportunity to evolve.
Britannia Unchained is a polemic on Britain and the promise of Britain. Co-authored by five skid marks, four of whom are now senior members of the Cabinet. Echoing the worst of Joseph in Edgbaston (notably, that of itself gives a true indication of the thoughts of a young Sumption) seen again in his approach to Liverpool and the North a decade later.
While these pygmies are held up as our voice in the world, let alone the direction we seek for ourselves, we are truly lost. And in that comfortable anarchy of thought and purpose, the worst of our lizard brain thrives. The baseness of naked greed and spittle-flecked, puce-faced hatespeak becomes the acceptable and then accepted as the norm.
I reflect on those poor, hopeful souls in Texas - the ones lost to us and the ones who may still lose themselves in whole or in part to this unfathomable act of violence. I don't know where to start other than to stop. Perhaps America has lost hope. It is for its people and its leaders to find a way to navigate back to hope. From hope to promise. From promise to fulfilment.
But in some ways, bugger the US. We have our own house to put in order. We must raise our head and look to where we want to go, who we wish to become and try - just try - to agree on how to get there. These are uncomfortable discussions to have. But having them isn't the end point. It's the beginning and there must be, there simply must be, a better end product.
I pray for them andhold them in my thoughts and in my heart.
I can do better today than I did yesterday. And so I must do better. Join me.
Photos have started to be released of the victims, they're only babies. It's senseless and horrific and heartbreaking.
There was a stat that says that last year in the States the largest killer of under 21s was guns. How the f*ck is that even a thing? More than cars, illness.
PP in this case but there have been plenty of cases where school shooters have simply helped themselves to guns at home. Keeping them secure in some manner would also help to prevent small children accidentally shooting each other and their parents.
I am still amazed that the US Supreme Court has repeatedly decided that "a well regulated militia" actually means "anyone with a pulse and a wallet".
I don't think they have. I think they defined those words as meaningless preamble and therefore of no legal effect. Trouble is I doubt Amy B would know an ablative absolute if it stripped itself naked, painted itself purple, and danced on a piano shouting "abble abs are here again".
There are too many guns in the US now to reverse the position, the starting point for any solution has to assume that guns will continue to be part of US society. Control over weapon types, licencing, storage and accessories are all practical possibilities - baby steps.
To be fair our own firearms licensing is a bit nuts. I sent them a letter from my GP about three months confirming various things based on my GP's notes and I now have a visit from the police next week. Not sure their visit would pick up whether or not I've developed a huge drug habit since my GP last saw me a decade ago.
It is horrific but it happened in Texas, its their choice to allow this madness to continue. A tragedy for the individuals but the society brought it on themselves, there are many problems in the world I care more about.
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This is price the republicans think is worth paying for their penis extenders.
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Why do all Old Bill talk like knobs?
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why don’t they ban the guns ffs
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i mean i know intellectually why they don’t and i get it (from a practical perspective)
but jesus h christ this is like the second mass shooting this week
ban the fvcking guns
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"Why do all Old Bill talk like knobs? "
Yes, that's the takeaway from the death of 14 children and their teacher.
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198 mass shootings this year in America. Most don't make the news.....
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Read the room ducks you antediluvian pillock.
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Such a weird country. It’s first world economically, on the whole, but it’s legal system, approach to firearms, healthcare system, incarceration rate and prison system and lots of other things are banana republic level.
They can’t be trusted with guns. The aussies brought in bans after Port Arthur, we did it after Dunblane. Seven billion mass shootings later and the NRA still think giving more Americans guns is the answer.
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Are there more shootings under democrat presidents?
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Kids would have been aged between 6 and 10. FFS.
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here we go
<disclaimer this is speaking in huge generalities>
the problem obediah is that the american police system is 1) underfunded 2) state controlled and 3) institutionally racist
in rural areas the sheriffs office could be a 45 minute drive away (if you’re lucky and reach someone that night)
in urban areas people literally won’t call the police no matter what’s happening (particularly if they’re Black)
self defence and home defence is therefore baked in
so people feel they need guns (because all the criminals have guns)
there is no simple way to fix this in a country that size - and that’s just the practical issues before you even start on the politics
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Nah - the main problem is the yanks have a massive fetish for guns. They glorify them. Which is why they are the last civilian population on earth that should be allowed them.
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America is broken
What cru said, those poor babies
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no some fetishise them i agree
but many just feel they genuinely need them to “protect their home”
and that’s because they don’t trust the state / police to do that (for varied reasons)
it’s an endemic problem
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But guns don’t kill people!
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would be interested to hear from any aussies who were around when the amnesty/ban came in
assume they had similar issues
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the stories on the news are horrific
and there’s the underlying depressing understanding that this won’t change anything at all
its a nightmare
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It’s inherent massive mistrust of the state and big government and the only way people think they can protect themselves from all that is to have guns. Plus the constitutional right to bear arms is sacred.
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4,300 in a year! Fvck their home protection. Get a baseball bat, or a dog.
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It’s irreversible. How can you ban them when every person owns 6? They’ll just bury them in their gardens then dig them up when they want to go on a mass killing spree.
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No offence to my several good American friends. But as a society, the US is sick, and if you want Britain to be more like the US, as our Right of course do; then you want more of this kind of thing here.
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it is really too pitiful to think about( those poor little mites dying like that, petrified as they must have been
blameless little lemmings
it makes me cry
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No,actually we want Britain to be more like Britain
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i know jack its awful
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conservatism is responsible for this shite
OGR, Britain is and at all points has been exactly like Britain HTH
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Except when we were in the EU.
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we’ve actually become more like a european country since brexit tho (all the bad bits), so that’s a fooking dumb thing of u 2 write ogr
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obviously incorrect; kindly do not post nonsense again
your beloved brexit will be reversed completely within five years anyway; and this time there’ll be a triple lockah on ever leaving again, a written constitution that starts “BRITAIN IS A MEMBER OF THE EUROPEAN UNION”, and we will immediately join the euro, forego any rebate and agree to QMV on all member state voting
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Any vote to defend the second amendment is knowingly, and inexcusably, a vote for small children to die like these in texas today
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They've got themselves into a turbo-fooked mess and these poor little kids are the victims of nutjobs spouting freedom. This is on the NRA and all their sick followers. There is literally no way out of it though. Even the Dems don't really advocate banning all guns.
I would fkin hate my kids to go to school in the US. How the fk can schools be places which might be the scene of a massacre because of some internet-recluse gimp holding his dad's gun.
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incel alt right ideology = religious extremist ideology
comes 2 the same
there rn’t ne woke centrists murdering ppl 4 their beliefs
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end all gun rights now
a Dem-controlled federal government should organise overnight armed law enforcement raids on every household thought to own a gun. Everywhere across the country simultaneously.
all guns found on premises should be confiscated and destroyed same day
yeah there’s be weeping and greeting and litigation (and probably some shooting) but fook it, those destroyed guns wouldn’t be coming back
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“from my cold, dead hands”
ok sir if you insist
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🙄
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Wait until the nutjobs start spouting their conspiracy theory about how this is fake/staged (as they did after Sandy Hook, harassing the grieving parents for perpetrating the "fraud")--that is when you truly despair of humanity.
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https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2017/may/02/sandy-hook-school-hoax-massacre-conspiracists-victim-father
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sick fooks
I wish I could do a job where I help children rather than just pushing paper for tedes all day
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Port Arthur and the Australian gun amnesty.
Australians were just so shocked by the massacre, and the government acted so quickly that it all just kinda happened.
The government introduced the gun reform package legislation in less than two weeks after the massacre. People didn’t really have time to react or organise opposition to it.
Also Australians don’t have any real legal rights (except for the handful set out in our constitution) and certainly no right to bear arms.
So once the govt of the day passed the legislation it was done. There was no possibility of legal challenges.
people whinged and moaned about it .. but nothing really stops anyone from applying for a licence to get a gun if they have a good reason to have one.
I have debated getting one myself but can’t be bothered with the admin.
But the kinds of gun you can own are very very limited, certainly no automatic weapons, and you have to have a licence and store it in certain ways.
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"risky. 24 May 22 22:22
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Are there more shootings under democrat presidents?"
Is there anything - literally anything - that you won't attempt to use as some sort of right-wing hobbyhorse? Utterly repulsive.
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Pipe down Josip - it was a question
laz 2347 - of course you could if you actually had any backbone and convictions
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The only way this can be sensibly discussed is to preface every debate with the thoughts and sounds of a classroom of 8 year olds being slaughtered one by one.
Fųcking animals. Disgusting stupid, selfish fųcking animals. What a thing to wake up to. Imagine the parents and the thoughts of their little one's deaths haunting them for every waking moment until they die.
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bit of a silly comment, tbh
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I think it's fair to say there is some judicial intellectual dishonesty going on when judges say that the legislators did not intend constitutional amendments to cover abortion, but say "look at the words!*" when asked if the legislators intended the constitution to permit free access to assault rifles.
* "but not all!!!"
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Are you referring to tromb’s comment?
if so, why? Why is it a silly comment?
In the immediate aftermath (when, presumably, their reactions would be as visceral as they are ever going to be) of the murders of 19 children and their teacher, by a kid armed with assault rifles, who had just killed his grandmother, and who shot two law enforcement officers (who happened to be passing by, and are the only reason the death toll isn’t higher), the response from “pro gun” (how is that even a thing?) lawmakers has been “whoa, easy tiger, slow your roll, let’s not get carried away with trying to fix this little “problem” we seem to be having”!
Over the years, these same people will have seen endless footage of devastated parents waiting outside the schools to find out if their kid lived or died. They will have watched surviving children being led out of their school to a world they no longer understand. They will have watched the mass funerals. They will have seen interviews years down the line of bereaved families, surviving children talking about what it is to watch your friends be shot while you scramble to hide or beg for your life. They should have seen enough of these events for their first thought to be “anything, literally any little thing that makes this even a bit less likely has to be worth doing, oh and why does any civilian need an assault rifle anyway, and erm, background checks could be a good thing, you know?” Instead of “but, but, our guns!! they’re well nice, and shiny, and none of our buddies would do anything naughty with them, and that’s what matters, right?”
So yeah, maybe someone needs to make it really real for them, make them listen to the horror and fear, see actual death happening in real time, make them go in with whichever poor people have to collect the bodies and clear the scene, watch the bodies being carried out, see them while they are still warm and very recognisably human and not “unfortunate byproducts” or “collateral damage”.
Because fook all else seems to have worked to change their minds, what else is left?
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Its so horrific I can barely process it. Now I have kids I just dont want tonthink about this stuff anymore.
Key practical takeaway:
We need to distance ourselves from the US. Everyone needs to look for opportunities to do so. Ignore their dumb politics and the way it poisons western discourse. Work to get the Tories out. Try to avoid dumb ID politiics. Try to reverse Brexit or get closer to the EU again. The EU is shit in so many ways but leaving it was about getting closer to the US model and we simply dont want to get closer to the US than we already are.
I tend to avoid discussing politics in the real world. But Im trying now to use opportunities to explain to friends and family why I think we need to remove the current Tories from power at all costs.
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Needs someone to attend the NRA conference with an automatic weapon and let loose.
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Not sure what mid-nineties pop bands are going to add to the discussion.
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"No offence to my several good American friends. But as a society, the US is sick, and if you want Britain to be more like the US, as our Right of course do; then you want more of this kind of thing here."
Sir woke, the British right does not want a US approach to gun control. It's juvenile to suggest it does.
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Heh CW your aims are diametrically opposed. The tories are the only ones who will stop the pandering to ID politics
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I am still amazed that the US Supreme Court has repeatedly decided that "a well regulated militia" actually means "anyone with a pulse and a wallet".
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These emotional outbursts aren’t really conducive to rational policy making.
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The Republican solution - arm teachers.
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You don't even need a ban initially to start dealing with this stuff. Simple legislation requiring guns to be kept locked up at home so teenagers can't just help themselves to them would be a starting point that would help the situation. I can't imagine ever thinking it's fine to leave guns out openly when you've got kids around.
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Yeah. That’s not what happened, Sailo. He went out on his 18th birthday and bought them himself (legally).
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No sign of mental illness no sign of oddness, the only way this massacre could have been prevented is not allowing sales of semi automatic arms to 18 year olds.
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sky.25 May 22 08:36
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Heh CW your aims are diametrically opposed. The tories are the only ones who will stop the pandering to ID politics
u may be right risky. I dislike Id politics and we keep importing more of it from US. But tories tend to do their own version of it and like to keep it brewing as it benefits them electorally.
and tbh if its a choixe between some tedious trans rights threads and american political and economic approaches Ill put up with the former.
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Various thick-necked fvckwits doing the rounds telling us the answer is mOrE gUnS iN ScHoOLs
its extraordinary that they get away with claiming restrictions on gun ownership doesn’t work either, look at literally every single other developed nation on earth ffs
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The concern is the large amounts of fringe money setting agendas from the US into the UK via Tufton Street etc. The web of creatures of the right who go from student unions to "think tanks" to SPAD jobs or the like is repulsive. Their echo chamber thinking never has the opportunity to evolve.
Britannia Unchained is a polemic on Britain and the promise of Britain. Co-authored by five skid marks, four of whom are now senior members of the Cabinet. Echoing the worst of Joseph in Edgbaston (notably, that of itself gives a true indication of the thoughts of a young Sumption) seen again in his approach to Liverpool and the North a decade later.
While these pygmies are held up as our voice in the world, let alone the direction we seek for ourselves, we are truly lost. And in that comfortable anarchy of thought and purpose, the worst of our lizard brain thrives. The baseness of naked greed and spittle-flecked, puce-faced hatespeak becomes the acceptable and then accepted as the norm.
I reflect on those poor, hopeful souls in Texas - the ones lost to us and the ones who may still lose themselves in whole or in part to this unfathomable act of violence. I don't know where to start other than to stop. Perhaps America has lost hope. It is for its people and its leaders to find a way to navigate back to hope. From hope to promise. From promise to fulfilment.
But in some ways, bugger the US. We have our own house to put in order. We must raise our head and look to where we want to go, who we wish to become and try - just try - to agree on how to get there. These are uncomfortable discussions to have. But having them isn't the end point. It's the beginning and there must be, there simply must be, a better end product.
I pray for them andhold them in my thoughts and in my heart.
I can do better today than I did yesterday. And so I must do better. Join me.
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Pro-life but only if they get to keep their guns.
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Let them all keep their guns (just don't give them any bullets)
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Photos have started to be released of the victims, they're only babies. It's senseless and horrific and heartbreaking.
There was a stat that says that last year in the States the largest killer of under 21s was guns. How the f*ck is that even a thing? More than cars, illness.
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the number of gun deaths in the US is absolutely staggering - in 2021 there were SIX HUNDRED AND THIRTY NINE MASS SHOOTINGS (more than 4 people shot)
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It’s shocking
and it doesn’t happen anywhere else in the developed world
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The total number of US service personnel killed over the last 247 years is 1.3 million.
Total individuals killed (not wounded, actually killed) by domestic US gun incidents over last 47 years is... 1.4 million.
Fųcking, fųcking, fųcking imbeciles.
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Eyes getting misty in front of the computer. Good thing not a lot of people in the office today.
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PP in this case but there have been plenty of cases where school shooters have simply helped themselves to guns at home. Keeping them secure in some manner would also help to prevent small children accidentally shooting each other and their parents.
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I don't think they have. I think they defined those words as meaningless preamble and therefore of no legal effect. Trouble is I doubt Amy B would know an ablative absolute if it stripped itself naked, painted itself purple, and danced on a piano shouting "abble abs are here again".
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I saw a Twitter thread this morning with pictures of all of them.
All those innocent little faces.
I can't imagine the pain their families must be experiencing right now.
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“Laz 2347 - of course you could if you actually had any backbone and convictions”
shut up you great dullard. you don’t know me from Adam.
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There are too many guns in the US now to reverse the position, the starting point for any solution has to assume that guns will continue to be part of US society. Control over weapon types, licencing, storage and accessories are all practical possibilities - baby steps.
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To be fair our own firearms licensing is a bit nuts. I sent them a letter from my GP about three months confirming various things based on my GP's notes and I now have a visit from the police next week. Not sure their visit would pick up whether or not I've developed a huge drug habit since my GP last saw me a decade ago.
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It is horrific but it happened in Texas, its their choice to allow this madness to continue. A tragedy for the individuals but the society brought it on themselves, there are many problems in the world I care more about.
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This is one of the many reasons why you could not pay me enough to live in the US, and I'm not even keen on the idea of visiting.
One of the children who died in the Sandy Hook shooting was British. The parents must feel that moving to the US was the worst mistake of their lives.
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‘It’s shocking
and it doesn’t happen
anywhere elsein the developed world’Fixed that for you FF.
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It’s not difficult to diagnose you suffer from ‘little man syndrome’ laz, even if physically you’re a porker
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