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Rory Stewart, Prisons Minister

whatever your politics, interesting person.

odd fish.

intelligent and coherent.

Have a look at his Wikipedia page

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rory_Stewart

the walk through Afghanistan

"His speech about hedgehogs in Parliament in 2015 was named by The Times and The Telegraph as the best parliamentary speech of 2015 and described by the Deputy Speaker as "one of the best speeches she had ever heard in Parliament".

 

Must be a rare fellow who elicit such praise talking about hedgehogs.

Whatever one has to say above about his politics, schooling, appearance and othordoxy (or lack of it) , he seems to me to have a refreshing ability to articulate complex things simply. That is a great gift. 

He is also very open in his attitude to debate and respect for opinion. He is no shouty bumblast or blowhard.  He tends calmly to grapple with the point against him and doesn't seek to belittle the opposition, but instead just forensically dismantles arguments like we might expect strong parliamentary debaters to do (but so few do) .

It is entirely non-vogue behaviour. Thank goodness.  I'd say that if he was, politically, 180 degrees opposed to his apparent political convictions. I just respect this now too rare form of public servant.  I am sure it won't do him any good as twitter, sound bites, shouty finger stabbing and condemnation are the way of the world now, apparently irreversibly so.

I also like that he recognises the importance of time in role and the value of experience to performance, plus he is prepared to be measured on performance if he is given time. I wonder how he will fare on this statement in 2018 when 2019 unwinds. 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-45214414

He does not give off that terrible whiff of entitlement you saw from Cameron, and see now daily from Johnson and Rees-Mogg, his fellow Etonians. There is humility and vulnerability.  I suspect this has quite a lot to do with the experience he has had in life.  I too may read that book. 

The book is worth a read. He is an odd fish. The sheer pointless risk he took with the walk is just so weird though. 

I think he probably genuinely wants to do good in the world though and that is a rare thing.

Agree, his wiki makes him sound like a good egg.  Always somewhat suspicious of anyone who gives their life to public service, but then I am a cynical w**ker.  

Couple of amusing extras in the detail of the wiki page. 

1. Delivered his and his wife’s first child himself ‘in the absence of medical assistance’.

2. Was a member of the Labour Party as a teenager. 

Muttley, saying someone gives off a 'whiff of entitlement' is a difficult criticism to combat. anybody who already dislikes the critiqued individuals will be minded to agree. It's a criticism that a 'blowhard' would likely make in the pub....soz

Ok, I take your point and was clearly just undercooking the point out of an erroneous sense of mild manners. Perhaps this very specific statement is better:

Boris Johnson and David Cameron, among others in public office who have included George Osborne (and going back a bit Alan Clark, Jonathan Aitken, Jeffrey Archer and so on) make the terrible mistake of wearing their elite education and/or wealth (whether trickling down over generations or recently acquired) on their sleeves like the captain’s armband for all to see. In every word and gesture there is a failure to recognise the lucky star they were born under and how many of their country were not. This is evinced in a constant lack of humility, an assumption of territory and air as if by Devine Right of Kings, delight in not understanding the issues of the day which concern many, a tendency to pursue policy which divides, an instinct which assumes they are right on a point and don’t need to meet the normal standards of scrutiny usually applied (such as logic, evidence, the balance of rights and entitlements, rational debate, accountability, respect for social justice, openness to the opinion of others, recognition that there are very few things in life at all that are entirely unarguably right or wrong). This is their way because that narrow perspective is how they were raised and that’s what they think. They have had it reinforced, have never had it properly challenged through personal experience or uncomfortable stretches beyond the known world of cloistered contentment in school, university and Westminster and just remain constantly reinforced by affirmatory experiences because they are surrounded by like minds and a lack of diverse perspective.  

I think another word for it would be self-regarding.

It is instilled young and fixed, then craved and reinforced. 

Sort of interview with him in the Standard a few days ago - idea floated of him as a Tory unity candidate for leader.....Osborne on board? Sadly it’s not going to happen- he’d probably be pretty good in current circumstances. 

If RS has any sense he will bide his time while the Brexit thing thrashes its way to an unlamented end.

But after that he should deffo be in the Cabinet / Shadow Cabinet.

Yes Wang. And her direct ancestor, Devine the Wide, entered into a bargain to nosh off Henry 1. It bound the entire lineage and that is what the Devine right of kings is - the right of the king to be noshed off on demand. Hugh had to pay, though.

His book on his time spent as a senior CPA official in Iraq is well worth reading. Fascinating character, though i imagine that interpersonally he is a little odd.

If RS has any sense he will bide his time while the Brexit thing thrashes its way to an unlamented end.

Half the problem with this Brexit thing is that anyone sensible is trying to stay out of it. 

 

Started his Afghanistan book last night. Seems a decent person and he's a good story-teller, which is maybe what we need  to combat all the bullshit coming out of the Brexit camp.

V good Spurius. 

the joke in the book was that Gabbitas and Thring was a recruitment agency of old for independent school staff.  The drawing showed them with a net, closing in on an unsuspecting teacher in the bushes. 

 

I just thought it looked a tad like the subject of the thread

heh, rory stewart came across as so entitled last night that he disengaged at points, not even bothering to listen to the other candidates.

 

Javid came across as the strongest most likeable

Diceman, I don't think he presented as being so entitled, but was bored at the stupideness of the others unrealistic positions, along with them all failing to answer the questions put to them. 

Javid  is a slimy, power hungry loon. The boring back story about his poor parents, and dad being a bus driver is not relative. What he should say is I was " Global head of x bulge bracket, earnt millions, retired at 35, and now am giving this a go. I am so wealthy and you can be like me to!"

either diceman is allowing his preconceived opinions to run complete riot through his ability to judge a person, or he was watching a totally different debate to every other viewer in the world

Rory has the kind of rictus smile I could imagine seeing if I was woken up one morning being stabbed to death by a serial killer. 

I can just about see him getting into the final two. I can’t see the blue rinse brigade giving him a chance, they did that for Cameron who was altogether more “nice young man” seeming than Rory and I’m not sure many of them feel that was such a great choice they should be repeating it. 

they were all dire and none of them had even the slightest inkling of a clue about what they are going to do about brexit

the only sane way forwards is to relax in the knowledge that there is not the slightest thing any of us can do about the forthcoming catastofook

They are all appalling.

Rory may know how to talk to the chattering classes but he is in a party leading us down a path of national self-harm and he knows it.  He is in the wrong party his party know it and so does everyone else.  In some ways he is the worst of the lot -he knows how ridiculous Brexit is but wants to be the PM responsible for bringing it about anyway.  Overprivileged, old boy network, self interested khunt.

Ebitda if I may be so bold that is a very silly thing to say. Little Rory didn't choose his school but that is irrelevant. What is relevant is that WE get to choose the government and WE get to choose who is in that government and saying "it's not the fault of the elites that they are the elites" is a bizarre form of back to front thinking. We should demand better from our government and we should vote for people who are there on merit and not as part of a power reproduction system.

​​​​​About the OE thing, those I have met in person ( none of them politicians) have all been very charming with ability to make you feel what you say is important and you are only person in the room etc.

which flies in face of those current OE’s who have recently been in power.

maybe its something to do with having had a particular housemaster or something as opposed to being a product of the whole school. Or maybe down to the Dragon prep school years. Dunno.

purely anecdotal observation, ofc.

Heffalump19 Jun 19 09:14

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they were all dire and none of them had even the slightest inkling of a clue about what they are going to do about brexit

the only sane way forwards is to relax in the knowledge that there is not the slightest thing any of us can do about the forthcoming catastofook

 

 

Is this a bit like trying to completely relax your body when you realise your parachute isn't going to open?

Rory has the kind of rictus smile I could imagine seeing if I was woken up one morning being stabbed to death by a serial killer. 

heh

there is humility and vulnerability. 

This is true, and I too appreciate these qualities. Unfortunately, they are not qualities political leaders often possess. The masses are easily duped by the ruthless, by those who appear "strong". True strength brings with it vulnerability.

 

Guy why is he over privileged? It wasn’t his choice to go to Eton. 

Not sure what whether it was his choice or not has to do with it, but anyway I don't have a problem with his privilege per se my problem is that his privilege has led him to the Tory party for tribal reasons - whereas everything he says suggests that he is not a tory by conviction 

he was looking for a seat around 2008/2009 - labour govt was on its last legs. I think that's why he went to the Conservative party... (not tribal reasons)

 

if it had been 1995....

if he had humility he would say, what he undoubtedly believes, "it is now clear Brexit does not work, in that and in many other respects I am at odds with  majority in this party and I hereby join the lib dems."

what's wrong with opportunism?

One might hope that one goes into politics because one has a vision for society that one would like to see and want to make that happen, not simply that one wants power and prestige so go for the first opportunity to get there regardless of the beliefs of the party you are representing.  Although perhaps that is naïve, particularly in respect of Tory MPs

@hotnow , decent point to be fair. But the “regulatory” framework for the appointment of a new leader/PM in these circumstances is not the fault of Stewart.

i agree in these circumstances there should be an automatic GE and no one should be corinated by its own party.

About the OE thing, those I have met in person ( none of them politicians) have all been very charming with ability to make you feel what you say is important and you are only person in the room etc.

Minkie, you realise this is a taught response and tells you absolutely nothing about their character (many psychopaths and sociopaths are charming, indeed more likely to be than the general population)

There has always been an OW mafia lurking in government but seems someone from Winchester has only once held the top job.

I do get bored of people who beat you with the privilege stick whilst apparently assuming your first words were "mother I insist on being privately educated".

What sails said . Besides a former boss who attended Eton yonks ago and became a governor said almost 40% of students receive assistance with fees on a financial needs basis  . Doesn’t sound like over privilege to me , certainly no more than someone who went to Dulwich , charterhouse ,KCS,Westmimister or sherborne.

OEs get an unnecessary poor press

Saillaw - you've missed the point. It's not about the individuals it's the conveyor belt which propels those individuals to power which needs to be changed. I'm sure Rory and chums are good eggs. I don't care. They aren't the best we (the UK) have - they are only the best who had access to the conveyor belt.

Put it this way, could you imagine that Goldman Sachs would recruit 60% of their staff from Eton? They wouldn't be in business if they only took from such a restricted talent pool. They look global. We can't look global for our PM but we should be looking wider than 1 or 2 public schools.

I've been screaming for a long time that the system needs reform to ensure people have had lives before politics rather than going to the right uni then spending a stint in party HQ or the like before finding a seat.  The US has gone too far the other way but there should almost be a financial barrier to entry to ensure that MP's have had a career before politics.

The US has gone too far the other way but there should almost be a financial barrier to entry to ensure that MP's have had a career before politics.

 

Jesus fvcking Christ please tell me you are not serious?  Does it occur to you that people can make very worthwhile contributions to society that doesn't involve making lots of money for themselves?  I really cannot believe you seriously believe what you have just said but given virtually every pronouncement you make on anything is inexorably wrong perhaps I should not be surprised.

Guy you'll see I'm not strictly advocating that as it's clearly a blunt tool and in the US it means you have a government of geriatric oil barons.  However, currently far too many of our politicians pass through a politics related degree then go to work for the part or in something politics related before being offered a safe seat and ending up in parliament with no idea how the rest of the world works as shown by them being shocked at having to provide receipts to claim expenses as the rest of have to.  I'm not sure what the answer is as clearly putting a minimum age on being an MP wouldn't have the desired effect either.

Hot the OE network would be less use if you needed to get a real job first as it no longer really helps on that front but does help if you want to slip into working in Tory Central Office to then blag a job as a bag carrier/SPAD.

You two got any bright ideas?

Who said that he's not arrogant?

'Tory leadership contender Rory Stewart has called on his rivals to drop out so he can take on frontrunner Boris Johnson in the final ballot to choose the party's next leader and the UK's new prime minister.'

Ok Sails I see what you mean - so a proper job earning over e.g 40k a year which was not for a company owned by your family or a friend of your family or a political sponsor - worth thinking about but tricky to implement. The rich can always pull strings to fabricate experience on the CV. Look at Donald trump he only got a 'small loan' from his dad to land his first job - as CEO of his own company. 

Why shouldn't a nurse be an MP hotnow?  There are lots of worthwhile "proper" jobs where you earn less than £40k.  It is frankly breathtaking you think otherwise.

What Guy said.  

I don't mind people who worked for their family provided that they got the job on their merits and started at an appropriate level and worked their way up rather than being parachuted in to a token senior role.

Just need to be something that stops the PPE, party HQ/lobbying, safe seat merry go round.

No because minimum age excludes people who didn't go to uni and have more work experience than someone of the same age who went to uni then did the LPC, etc.

I don't know the answer but as I'd expect you two would rather simply make sarcastic comments and throw around abuse rather than making a useful suggestion.

There was a thread on this not so long ago about the qualifications that a MP should have before election. I for one and many agreed that no one should be an MP unless they have had five continuous years work as a miniumn doing anything. Dr, Nurse, teacher, bus driver, checkout assistant, cabbie.

 

I exclude in this Sports men/women, Journalists, and TV presenters agreed?

throw around abuse rather than making a useful suggestion.

 

Sorry but anyone who suggests some sort of income/property qualification for being an MP deserves abuse.

Personally I see no evidence of a problem with MPs the problem lies with the quality of those MPs getting into government.  

Fair enough I find the majority of MP’s far from impressive although my local MP how had a life before politics seems a fairly sensible chap who’s reasonably down to earth and not slavishly following the party line.

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