A remainer confession

I accept Brexit has meant we rolled out the vaccine faster than we probably would have otherwise have done.

Perhaps.  I think we also got it right taking a punt on a number of vaccines rather than being patriotic and putting our faith in a home grown vaccine as the French seem to have done.

As we slowly die off, either from starvation or fighting each other over the last turnip in the shop we can be proud in the knowledge that brexit helped us get a covid vaccine marginally quicker than our DEADLY ENEMIES in the EU.

So proud of this great nation.

If you subscribe now for just £99.99 per month I'll give you direct access to my 50 acres of turnips when Armageddon comes.

Royalty I was and remain dead against Brexit, I could not see any benefit whatsoever.  This was quite a decent benefit however.   It gives me at least some hope they may be others in the future.

I don't. If it were not for Brexit the UK would have been a leading part of any EU wide strategy, not least because we still would have had the EMA based here. I slightly doubt we would have agreed to an EU wide strategy but if we had it wouldn't have been the same as the one actually agreed.

This is one of the issues about Brexit: you can never safely identify what would have happened without Brexit with what happens in the EU after Brexit, because the EU without the UK is a VERY different beast to the EU with the UK.

It was one of my reasons for being so strongly remain: I think the EU was stronger and better with us, and will be more brittle and less flexible without us.

We should probably wait and see what happens in terms of actual vaccine roll out in the UK before we are too smug about this but yeah, the EU does seem to have royally fvcked this up. I was speaking to a couple of German colleagues the other day and they are pretty p1ssed off. 

If this is seen as costing the med nations another tourism season there will be hell to pay! 

Srsly, why would anyone fight over a turnip?  They are proper minging, second only to auberghines in the great list of devil's veg.  Unless you keep pigs i spose.

on wot basis guy?

i thought public health remains a member state matter, so the uk could have done the same thing here, if it wished, within the eu. it could have decided to join the eu-wide one and the eu may have been better for it. incidentally, that’s one of the most irritating things about brexit - the uk actually made the eu better at these sorts of things and so it was a collective good

i don’t subscribe to heff’s argument entirely - there r some things u can undoubtedly “what if” with a high degree of certainty - eg trade

AND WE WOULD HAVE BEEN FORCED TO JOIN THE EURO AND VACCINES WOULD HAVE BEEN ADMINISTERED BY SOLDIERS FROM THE EUROPEAN ARMY

the other critical point is that our govt has been massively helped by our pre-eminent scientific community (which they have done very little to help over the last ten years)

so there r aspects of the vaccine successes which no doubt tozzas will crow about, but actually have not really been anything to do with the govt

"

This is one of the issues about Brexit: you can never safely identify what would have happened without Brexit with what happens in the EU after Brexit, because the EU without the UK is a VERY different beast to the EU with the UK.

It was one of my reasons for being so strongly remain: I think the EU was stronger and better with us, and will be more brittle and less flexible without us."

This.

Maybe the Germans (and Dutch and Poles etc) will get fed up with the French in a few years and suggest a new Hanseatic League. I'd be up for that.

Oracle, I think there would have significant pressure to join the eu wide scheme that we would probably have succumbed too.  I take your point we may have improved it.

Not sure, though could have been. The alternative argument is the govt cocked up so much else they invested in vaccine purchases as a final resort, whereas some European countries, particularly those that dealt with it effectively up to winter, were probably a bit complacent. 

Ultimately who cares? I saw the other day some vested interests were trying to peddle Brexit as the reason bee killing insecticides were allowed to treat a sugar beet infestation, even though the EU has allowed dispensation for several EU countries to do exactly the same. Does nobody just want the country not to be fooked and run by idiots? 

not sure 'confession' is the right word when you say something undeniable

Diceman that is utter cockrot. One of the four freedoms exemptions is public health. You can argue the UK would have "gone along" with an EU approach, but they didn't have to. Maybe stop listening to the "Gavin Williamson Isn't A Thick Bellend" podcast. 

yes, banana - guy said 'probably' in his op. and the fact that none of the 27 member states (or have they?) have used the exemption you mention might just suggest something...

I presume Guy's rationale here is political rather than legal. The government knowing they've fvcked up the country with Brexit are more incentivised to use the powers they already had to politically distance themselves from Europe to try and justify Brexit.

Maybe stop listening to the "Gavin Williamson Isn't A Thick Bellend" podcast. 
 

heh

yeah, while the government originally lied about it not being possible had it not been for Brexit, I think in reality we would have joined every other EU country and signed up.

I must admit I do admire Guy.

He's not a headbanger.  

I disagree with him on many things I'm sure, but I've got a feeling for how he thinks and we seem to think things through the same way (I'm probably flattering myself there).  We reach different conclusions, but that's fine you're not going to agree with everyone unless you're happy to take the prescribed opinion medicine.  

I can’t detect any  irony in that post so thanks! If it was meant ironically - fook you!

genuine 😂 at lolz believing himself anything other than an unquestioning indulger of the prescribed opinion medicine

he obv doesn’t realise his opinions r just regurgit7ed breitbart, but with even less reasoned bases