Parliament votes to stop Boris from proroguing it by 315-274

One more step on the road to cancelling brexit m8s

I think they would. Every time we ask for another extension we look weaker. The best PR for the EU is for us to say "actually we'd like to stay".

Ray - I'm not disputing that and agree that it is hardly unknown for political parties not to follow through on manifesto promises. I was responding to the very specific point that Laz made about the referendum result carrying "no weight" with Parliament.

laz is of course correct that the referendum result carries no weight with parliament

parliament is sovereign

the only weight the referendum carries, if any, is moral. and that weight is rapidly disappearing if it has not already

no weight with parliament

only weight [with anyone else]

FFS

Moral considerations somehow apply less to parliament than they do to [anyone else], then, do they?

It has no weight in either sense. It’s the great granddaddy of busted flushes.

EU will just stand their ground and wait for us to put it to another vote.

 

I don't agree with that (although it at least has the advantage of being internally consistent). There is a very real weight for those MPs who stood for election on a manifesto that they then failed to uphold, as they will have to justify themselves to their constituencies at the next election. That might be a greater or a lesser concern, obviously, depending on how Eurosceptic their constituencies are, but it's still likely to be a difficult point for them that their opponents will exploit. 

Spotty Lizard18 Jul 19 18:36

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Moral considerations somehow apply less to parliament than they do to [anyone else], then, do they?

yes, obviously

How's that, then? Do MPs have an equivalent of a medical exemption certificate or something?

The big question should be: what the hell were 274 MPs doing voting against this motion?

Spotty Lizard18 Jul 19 19:23

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How's that, then? Do MPs have an equivalent of a medical exemption certificate or something?

are u going to allow me the same joke?

no, they are politicians, by definition they do not have morals

but flippancy aside, I appreciate u think u have highlighted a contradiction and like the over-excited junior who has just read the template notes, u r eagerly awaiting ur opportunity to lance in with ur zinger

sadly for u, I am bored of this, so let’s just leave it with what we both know: 

the point is simple, MPs are bound by some moral obligations and not by others, so by pointing out there is no moral weight upon them vis-a-vis brexit I am quite clearly not saying (other than as a poorly timed joke which flew over ur head about politicians) that they are free from all moral considerations

a perfectly normal human being18 Jul 19 20:19

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The big question should be: what the hell were 274 MPs doing voting against this motion?

being tozzas and the northern irish taliban, what did u expect?

Can the good people of Vauxhall pls recall Hoey immediately, she is a complete embarassment,.

Delphi. Being rude and dismissive of others' arguments only has a chance of working when one's own position is well-reasoned and put forward coherently and cogently. Which your has not been so far. 

Some disconnected observations:

1  Proroguing Parliament in these circumstances sounds a lot like why we had a civil war in the 17th century.  Also in the period leading to the accession Parliament definitely took matters into its own hands - Bill of Rights etc.

2  A successful prorogue to exit without a deal looks a lot like a coup d'etat.

3 Yes once more step towards no Brexit - where do I push?

4 Ian Dunt ( politics.co.uk) is worth a read on Brexit - he does not believe in magic, unicorns, fairies or pixies.

5 What's anybody's height go to do with this?