Leaving someone you love

because sometimes, love just isn't enough.

Have you done this, how did you manage? I'm finding it very tough to pull the trigger so to speak. 

Why are you saying that? Ffs, I'm right on the edge of quitting. 

Depends doesn't it. Sometimes people we love aren't good for us 

true but then you get into the false consciousness side of things

if you REALLY love someone (not wisely but too well or otherwise) then I believe that is all there is

but you shouldn't love a psycho or suchlike

hope this helps, IG

on reflection, Othello was the wrong lad to cite in this context

She falls very firmly in the psycho camp. Yes, not good for me, as Linda says. 

ok then you are experiencing false consciousness and do not love her

pls describe some antics so that we can give you firmer advice

I did this when I was just starting out in acting. She had a normal job and our lives were heading in opposite directions. While I have moved on and am married now, it is one of the hardest things I have ever done and there have been far too many times when I have wondered whether it was the right thing to do. So only leave if you are sure. It's devastating.

Tangent. That sounds about right. I'm finding it immensely difficult and testing. Struggling. 

well, I am misusing the term but I think you get the idea

you THINK you love her because of the various external forces (and hormones) tricking you into believing it

but if she's horrid you don't love the real her

I'd always thought I wanted children. She doesn't want them. This is really the crux, leaving other issues aside. Can I give up having kids?

Your situation sounds different to mine though IG, as there was no psycho element. I had a long term relationship with someone who was like that when I was 18-20 and ending it was a massive wrench but in the long term was the best thing that could have happened.

I was just about to say that’s the reason that I split up in my early twenties.

Until I got together with Delfette five years later, I constantly had doubts about the decision,

 

I split with my first long term boyfriend because as much as I loved him, I knew it wasn’t right. Go with your gut. As my mum said, no point staying and making two people unhappy! 

I don't think I can give up kids. To me, most things in life seems pretty meaningless, and procreation, I'm hoping, will give my life purpose.

The other issues aren't the side issue to the kids thing 

the kids thing is a side issue to the psycho behaviour thing

for one, you shouldn't have kids with a nutcase; it will damage all of you. For another, whether or not you will have children is not ultimately entirely under your control, so I wouldn't leave someone I was truly happy with over that. 

Root ‘em and boot ‘em m8…

That’s the old Muggo Motto.

Root ‘em and boot ‘em.

How long have you been with her?  First year or so it is hard to distinguish love and affection that will last the distance from hormonal/chemical reaction that is commonly characterised as being "in love".

“Welcome to dumpsville, population you”

Simple m6. 

"sometimes, love just isn't enough"

what times?

It's been 8 months.

We once fell out over something relatively minor. She went mad, and got a knife and tried to slit her wrists in front of me. She can't handle discussion. She's very mentally unstable and suffers from depression. Everything is telling me to end it, but yet I'm finding it so difficult and I'm not sure why. I can't seem to apply logic to matters of the heart. I do love her. I want to help her.

Get rid. She might pop one out under duress then you’re stuck with a resentful wife and sad child whose mum is distant. 
 

Seriously, get rid.

I'd never force her into having a baby. I know it won't work like that. She's also 41 and has PCOS. Very difficult for her to conceive and actually I'm not sure her disposition is akin to make for a stable mother, or even a competent mother. She has zero patience.

She's very mentally unstable and suffers from depression.

Is she having treatment for her depression? 

Hmm. She sounds v dramatic. If you are questioning this after 8 months when that is usually a lovely honeymoon period it’s probably not right. 

No. She's had therapy. She tried pills but did not like the effect they had on her so stopped. She does cognitive therapy or something like that.

"I want to help her"

worst possible basis of a marriage ever 

It is very very difficult when you love someone and they love you. But once you have that feeling that something is not right it rarely goes away, in fact it becomes clearer and clearer until you can’t look/hear anywhere else. The first few months are HARD but you have to think of your long term and future happiness, you are not thinking about today or tomorrow’s Italian Guy, but Future Italian Guy. Inner strength will somehow carry you through. (Cringe but true). That weight will be very heavy on you until you leave, then it will disappear gradually. In my experience there was no “instant relief” but it happens over time. And it is better/healthier for both of you. Well that was my experience -  Good luck 

I think I've helped her quite a bit, but yes I understand it's basically all screaming me out for me to get out. Any help for me when I do this. We've had a big falling out and are due to chat later on this evening.

She does cognitive therapy or something like that.

ok, so you aren't interested enough to know what kind of therapy she is having... sounds like honeymoon period is over for you and you've had enough.  Be kind to her. 

I dont think you should rule out being with somebody because they suffer a mental illness, if you feel you can handle it and if you enjoy being with them most of the time.   Unless she is overly aggressive, which is a different matter entirely.

I am interested in her mental health. I've put up with all sorts, you have no idea. I have no intention to be anything other than kind to her. 

Given the screaming and the knife, I would break up in public 

do you live together? If not does she have a key to your house? If the latter emergency locksmith before you speak to her will be the best £100 you spend

She has no key to my flat or possessions here. In fact part of me thinks she knows this is coming and has known for some time. IN fact she once told me she wanted to enjoy the time we have together, however long that is. 

Problem is, for all her faults of which there are many, she's somehow managed to get deep inside my heart, and I'm finding it difficult get out. Words of advice to this extent much appreciated. 

I am interested in her mental health. I've put up with all sorts, you have no idea. I have no intention to be anything other than kind to her. 

I know I have no idea, IG, and didn't mean to be harsh. 

Children are ace, don't compromise on something so important.  She will meet someone else and have the same chance of happiness and recovery from her illness with them as with you.  You will too.

6 months is the honeymoon period for relationships.  It's probably not going to get better, rather the reverse.

 

lindaradlett22 Oct 21 10:19

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The other issues aren't the side issue to the kids thing 

the kids thing is a side issue to the psycho behaviour thing

for one, you shouldn't have kids with a nutcase; it will damage all of you.

 

This a thousand times over. Having kids drives you mad anyway, so best to start from a baseline of relative sanity. 

I love the girl. I wish I could make her better, happy. In the early stages she'd tell me how she just wanted to be loved for her, and that eventually everyone leaves her. I was determined to be different, so I've loved her for her, but it's taking its toll on me. It's just very sad. There is zero stability, and though I'm fairly strong mentally, I think overall I'm suffering mentally too now, because of her lack of stability and lack of ability to talk seriously about important matters without having a mental breakdown. 

If you are on the cusp now I imagine this feeling of wanting to end it has been growing over time.  You say you still love her and the thing is in the balance.  I don't really recomend it, but one thing you could do is just wait and see if your feeling of wanting to leave keeps on growing.  In a month's time it may become a very clear and easy decision. 

"I wish I could make her better, happy."

That's not love. 

I've wondered whether it would be wise for me to leave for some time now. Very early on the breakdown episode took place and she showed exactly how unstable she was. I should have left at that point. I think I feel sorry for her, but I do love her.

sorry i_g but it sounds like you want to save her, and it's your failure to do so that is complicating how you truly feel for her/the situation. Do you have a saviour complex? and didn't you post about this about 6months ago and receive all manner of advice about this was likely to play out...?

 

and what every else said about kids - that issue is entirely peripheral to the mental health issues.

Saviour complex? I want to save her yes. I love her, I think that's a normal thing to want to do. She also has many good qualities. Yes I did post about her about 6 moths ago. Same girl. High functioning anxiety and all that.

You're right about the kids thing ofc. It's just all wrong, and I need out. As I said, I'm finding it very hard to end it. Almost impossible. 

In the early stages she'd tell me how she just wanted to be loved for her, and that eventually everyone leaves her.

You need to help her understand and accept the fact that she is fundamentally unlovable. Sozzles. 

Everyone is saying that you should break up.

I think you know that too. And believe that it will be for the best.

The question is how, not if ...

Can you discuss the situation with someone in her family or a close mutual friend. Be clear that you are breaking up. Ask them from help and advice on how to do it. Try to get commitment from them that they will be especially supportive immediately after the break - perhaps even suggest that they and her go away together for a holiday  It might seem disloyal to discuss it behind her back, but it's not, you are doing it to support her.

I agree with with Elfffi and PP too. If she is unstable and you have shown too much love for her or strong love and affection, it would not be advisable to cut the relationship overnight. It would not make sense even to a sane person. 

Give yourself, say, until Christmas to break up safely if not slowly. You also have to understand her psychologically in terms of how to handle the break up safely for both of you.

After the relationship ends, try to understand what drew you to her. That’s really important as you don’t want to repeat it with the choice of your next partner. 

The incident with the knife above - threatening to harm oneself is emotional blackmail.  She may do something like this when you break up with her and so what Elffi said about someone close to her knowing what is happening.  You can talk to the Samaritans if someone is trying to harm themselves. 

rof has grown up, a few years ago advice would only have been offered after norks had been described.

What he said.  Leave, now.  Any proper relationship is one where 2 people bring something to the table.  You're not a social worker.  Don't waste your life.  You're being manipulated. 

not that it has any bearing on whether leaving your current is the right or wrong thing.

But what if you do leave her, you meet someone who is "perfect" in your view and she says she wants kids, but it turns out she cannot have kids?  

People talk about having kids like if-you-both-want-them-its-a-given.  Other than trying to impregnate after a ONS / short relationship, the criteria that she "must want kids" is not something which will definitely result in kids.

Yes, I'm just not sure why I'm struggling to execute. The "I'm not a social worker" line has also gone through my head. 

interesting point bubbles.

I've also thought of the scenario where I leave the current gf, find another and have babies, and end up in a life I hate and end up regretting current gf. I love current gf, let's not forget that. 

He’ll cross that bridge when he gets to it. 

First he needs to get out of the mentally exhausting relationship, then cool it off completely and understand where he was and where he wants to be and then find another partner. 

Italian_guy may find another partner who already has kids or adopt or have surrogate to bring his own kids to this world. There are solutions and it is not a problem anymore if someone really want to achieve and have family life. 

"Another relationship might not work" is not a reason to continue in a relationship that definitely isn't working.

"mentally exhausting" - that's a good description. She's certainly taught me I have the ability to be very patient with those I love. And I'm not generally a patient man.

If I get out of this relationship, the next will be with a woman for whom children are important, that's for sure. 

Reading some of this soppy nonsense, anyone would think they have been married for 18 years, not going out for 8 months (and not even living together)...

Why in heaven's name you need to spin it out to Christmas  - being kind would mean ending it as quickly, cleanly and firmly as possible - esp. as she has  aggressive tendencies. 

You should have followed the advice 6 months ago to get out - it was right then, and is right now.

M7, this is going to be shit for a bit but the sooner you start the sooner you’ll start feeling better. I truly love a woman, she is just amazing: beautiful, intelligent and strong but she was fooked over by her family and couldn’t accept the love mine was offering so we had to part.  For years I thought I could make her happy (and I did make her happier, but not enough). Because I love her I persisted for too long; I know that with hindsight.

I am now with Mrs Principle who is so much easier to love (I thought love you have to work at is better, stronger - it’s not).  It feels weird (to use Hoolie’s word from some time ago on a similar thread, a ‘yearning’) when I see pics of her (we are still friends) with a new man. But ending it was the right thing. I had no duty to make her happy, even though I really wanted to; neither do you.

Is it better to end over the phone or in person? Normally I'd never do it by phone or text, but it might be better in that she doesn't need to "put on a show" in her normally overdramatic way if I can't see it anyway?

You know when you know what the right thing to do is, but you don't do it? That's what I've been doing for ages now. It's bloody annoying. I've got a real soft spot for this seriously damaged unstable human. 

Hey Guy, I was in a very similar situation many years ago.

I left. It was the hardest thing I ever did and it was devastating for both. But it was the right thing and I would do it again. No doubt. If anything, I should have ended it sooner. If you make it through the initial pain, time will heal everything, you and her.

Cheers Unwalt. I'm not sure I'll end it tonight. I might try. I've been hit with a nasty cold which is making it tough for me to act assertively. 

FAOD: By no means did I say "rush". There is no good time for something like this. But you can easily botch it and make everything worse than it has to be. I wish you all the best. Leaving someone you love is likely among the toughest things you can do.

Unwalt, yes, I feel it's immensely difficult. Like my heart is being torn out of my chest if I'm being honest. I don't know whether I'll find the strength tbh. Not today. Not yet. 

Say you’ve got a bad bout of flu and that you can’t see her. And then don’t see her for 2 weeks and then extend it to a break up…job done!

Everyone always tries to talk themselves out of doing something like this as it's easier to avoid that conversation. Get it done ASAP. It's short term pain for immense long term benefit. Waiting until Christmas is crazy. Send her a text explaining how you feel, say you didn't want to blindside her on a call but then offer a chat when she's ready to speak. 

Forget curing her and concentrate on curing your desire to have kids. Have you get any nieces or nephews you can babysit so you can decide if you want kids when being woken up at 5 in the morning by a screaming brat? Or do you really have a taste for dealing with shit and vomit?

 

 

Important that you don't give mixed messages when you do it, as well. Don't be tempted to talk up how much you love her etc etc. You need to be very clear that it's over and there's no way back. 

I am starting to question whether this is a genuine situation or whether it is another one of IG's ingenious tunhunts.

Will you ask her "What would be the first thing you do if you found out you've been dumped?"

"Kill myself?"

"No, no. The VERY first thing ..."

I remember when IG used to post happy posts, about going to the gym in Croydon.

I am starting to question whether this is a genuine situation or whether it is another one of IG's ingenious tunhunts.

I thought that when he asked whether he should dump her by phone or not... looked like an attempt to invigorate the thread. 

Kimmy, that post was genuine. And I think I set out why I'd even consider doing it over the phone and not in the correct way which would be face to face. No attempt to invigorate. 

If/ When you do end it have a few lines prepared. Keep it short. If pushed say you will explain in more detail another time but it is really hard/draining right at this moment. The actual break up shouldn’t be longer than 30mins - not 3 hour agonising debate. Better for both parties. Though this approach depends on how reasonable/emotional/prepared the other person is I guess. 

I'm not breaking up. Want to hear what she has to say.

Make sure you don't do it at your house as you need to be able to leave. I'd go somewhere public myself if she is likely to make a scene. And you are also less likely to end up in bed with one another that way.

 

Cheers Unwalt. I'm not sure I'll end it tonight. I might try. I've been hit with a nasty cold which is making it tough for me to act assertively. 
 

sorry this made me lol. 

Decided to stay together. She's opened the door of possibility of babies in the future. She's nuts, but she's also great. And hey, maybe love is enough. 

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