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Should England throw the game tonight
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YossarianFriday
Posted - 28 June 2018 09:35
Given the state of the draw.

Personally go for a win, momentum and all and its not really in our character. Also given this world cup who is saying what side of the draw is easier. I would say the next game would be easier on the winners side.
Parsnip
Posted - 28 June 2018 09:39
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mexico could beat brazil

i think we go for the win

worst case scenario is going for the win, Belgium picking b team and us scraping by and playing badly
I don't feel like dancewang
Posted - 28 June 2018 09:42
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I agree, play for the win, ignore the draw, dont rest your best.
161 sleeps till Christmas
Posted - 28 June 2018 09:48
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Win, go for the win. Lift the spirits further still!
pancake humper
Posted - 28 June 2018 09:54
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It depends how the early games go. I think we'd find Colombia to be an extremely difficult R16 game, so however things need to go to avoid them is probably best.

The momentum win-the-game-in-front-of-you stuff is bollocks. It's the kind of standard, brainless England thinking that proud quarter-final exits are made of.
pancake humper
Posted - 28 June 2018 09:56
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The mere fact that this is being discussed makes me think foreign fans are right in what they think about the English,

Literally no fans in the world other than the English would think that ending up in the top half of this draw is anything other than idiotic.
MrSquaresMagicCircle
Posted - 28 June 2018 10:07
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Q is do England see themselves as winners, or would a good WC be something like semi-final or runners up? If winners, then win. You have to play someone good eventually.

This is funny though:

"It's the kind of standard, brainless England thinking that proud quarter-final exits are made of"
Wellington
Posted - 28 June 2018 10:12
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100% throw the game.

Can't believe people would rather Colombia then Brazil,

rather than

Japan and Switzerland

The belgians have it right, rest all your key players, lose or draw and the semi finals beckon.
I don't feel like dancewang
Posted - 28 June 2018 10:17
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Welly I am revoking your right to be English.
Chambers
Posted - 28 June 2018 10:20
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Don't care who we play next. Bang six or seven past Belgium and you've already got whoever worried.
I don't feel like dancewang
Posted - 28 June 2018 10:27
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CRY GOD FOR ENGLAND, HARRY AND PRINCE GEORGE
left-arm wheels
Posted - 28 June 2018 10:42
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Columbia, Brazil, we’ll sh1t em
GMT
Posted - 28 June 2018 10:56
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This apparent England revival (though the back 3 still looks to me a cause for real concern) is too fragile to start trying to be too clever especially given the debacles of 2 and 4 years ago. I think we have to try and win tonight to maintain this seeming fresh start culture.

Couple of changes is what I'd expect; Rose and Rashford to probably start, but not much else.
Misshoolie
Posted - 28 June 2018 11:04
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Play to win. Always.
pancake humper
Posted - 28 June 2018 11:13
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"Our defence looks dodgy so we should be looking to tee up games against Colombia and
Brazil instead of Japan and Switzerland"

Not sure the logic is entirely sound tbh

absolutely no other country's fans would be thinking this, and absolutely no other country's coaching staff would be giving any significant consideration whatsoever to deliberately losing the game.

We will see. Lukaku is already "injured", Martinez has been laying the groundwork in the press saying that winning this game isn't important, and the belief in Belgium seems to be that he'll start a massively changed team.
Wellington
Posted - 28 June 2018 11:15
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Martinez is resting 10 players ffs.

we should be doing the same. what is the point of having a squad and not using it.
Tee Pottt
Posted - 28 June 2018 11:29
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Of coarse England should play to win the game. Its great for the confidence of the players etc. That doesn't mean that they cant rest players etc The over riding objective has to be to win the WC not just the next game.
Muggy Mike
Posted - 28 June 2018 11:41
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What PC said.

Rest your best players or this has 'brave* quarter final exit' written all over it.

*by which I mean sweaty knackered players looking like lemons as the oppo runs rings around them
Muggy Mike
Posted - 28 June 2018 11:43
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although that isn't quite what PC said in hindsight.

OK, play out a bore draw with little or no running around, bring on Sterling for the last 2 minutes, make sure he gets himself sent off so we finish 2nd on the 'fair play' basis with the added bonus that he'll be banned from playing.

Job's a good 'un
Budgie Quay
Posted - 28 June 2018 12:20
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I kind of agree with the cyclical approach although I think that trying to actively throw the game would be disastrous for moral and a mistake. However - it’s an absolute no brainer to rest some of your key players. It’s a game we don’t need to win, unlike most of the other leading teams both ourselves and Belgium have earned the right to rest our teams. This should give both of us an advantage in next stages wherever we end up in draw.

Having selected a weaker team I would then rev them up as usual and talk about the imprortance of momentum etc. But I would have a quiet word with one or two of the second stringers and remind them it’s not the end of the world if they get booked.
Budgie Quay
Posted - 28 June 2018 12:21
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*cynical*
left-arm wheels
Posted - 28 June 2018 12:23
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They should do draws after three groups to see who plays who.
1st place teams in one pot and 2nd place teams in another, draw one from each pot and repeat.
Would prevent all the tactical b.s.
I haven’t thought this through so it’s probably a terrible idea tbf
left-arm wheels
Posted - 28 June 2018 12:28
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*after the group stage i meant
Not ‘after three groups’
Wellington
Posted - 28 June 2018 12:44
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trying to actively throw the game would be disastrous for moral and a mistake.trying to actively throw the game would be disastrous for moral and a mistake.

losing a game where you've rested people and actively said you're not arsed about winning is better for morale than going out to win it and losing anyway (which is a very real possibility)
Wellington
Posted - 28 June 2018 12:44
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They should do draws after three groups to see who plays who.
1st place teams in one pot and 2nd place teams in another, draw one from each pot and repea


100% agree, the problem with that is ticketing for fans, they won't know where they would be based.
csider
Posted - 28 June 2018 12:53
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play to win, get momentum, there are no teams to be feared in either side of the draw from what i've seen

ohh brazil beat serbia, so?

ohh portugal drew with a shite spain

ohh france?!

ohh argentina, looking woeful


it's coming home
left-arm wheels
Posted - 28 June 2018 12:53
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Excellent point wellers, that’s the first massive flaw in my plan
left-arm wheels
Posted - 28 June 2018 12:56
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Hang on

The fans don’t know where the team is playing next anyway do they? as it depends where we finish in the group
Wellington
Posted - 28 June 2018 13:02
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yeh but you have one of two options, and im fairly sure they locate them either in the same city or fairly close

whereas if it was random it would be much more difficult.
left-arm wheels
Posted - 28 June 2018 13:03
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On reflection you are right
current system gives fans a few days to sort accommodation
If everyone had to wait for the groups to finish before the draw took place there would be problems...
GMT
Posted - 28 June 2018 13:05
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Not with our defence it ain't csider.
left-arm wheels
Posted - 28 June 2018 13:08
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Just for interest it is a 13 houR drive between the two round of 16 stadiums for our group
3-ducks
Posted - 28 June 2018 13:15
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Maybe not throw the game, but we should not bust a gut.

Conserve energy and avoid injury at all costs.
left-arm wheels
Posted - 28 June 2018 13:16
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I hate the Spanish team
Fvck em all
left-arm wheels
Posted - 28 June 2018 13:18
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“Isco”
What a khunt
left-arm wheels
Posted - 28 June 2018 13:19
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Vardy starts over Kane
minkie
Posted - 28 June 2018 13:41
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I know NOTHING about football.
And yet somehow I have a strong feeling that the least surprising result will be a draw, either 0-0 or 1-1.

And then business as usual for England on the international stage.

Also...why all this glee Germany is out and fear over Brazil? If these countries are not playing at their best this year what is there to be afraid of? Does it really matter who the opponenents are beyond the group stages, they will all have proven themselves in the groups.
Muggy Mike
Posted - 28 June 2018 13:48
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two second string teams tonight - Belgium to change their entire outfield team, Kane, Maguire, Loftus-Cheek, Walker, Trippier, Young and *cough* Sterling all rested

No bad thing, fringe players will be keen to impress, might be a better game than watching the first teams rolling the ball back and forth between them for 90 mins
Muggy Mike
Posted - 28 June 2018 13:50
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'lso...why all this glee Germany is out and fear over Brazil?'

Because they both have good players and if they pull it out the bag are more than a match for England. Switzerland and co might be well drilled and making the most of what they have but I know who I'd rather play.
Wild Stallion
Posted - 28 June 2018 14:03
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Just fvcking beat them all.

The teams that win the world cup, and get to the final, generally finish first in their group and get a bit of momentum going.

There is the odd slow starter that goes on to do well. But rarely a team that starts well then fades, before going great guns again.

Just win.
Wild Stallion
Posted - 28 June 2018 14:09
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And FYI, England qualify as slow starters in this World Cup. The Tunisia victory was the classic not quite worked it all out yet, squander chances, promising attacking play but not quite there, ground out victory of a slow starting team yet to find their feet, but looking like contenders.